Vista + DX10

[ScottJC]

Now, for the argument "Vista wasn't released yet", it makes no sense for me.

Well if you hadn't had said "XP reigns over Vista" I might not have brought it up, that was a very stupid statement. How can Vista reign over XP when it hasn't even been finished yet, there is no price - what we have is beta builds - Beta builds can't compete with a finished product - Also XP is six years old, vista is far younger.

 

[WhiteX]

That´s exactly why i never get a new OS on launch, i mean, XP works for me, they should release DX 10 for XP and for some time release all games for both.

 

[Miretank]

That´s exactly why i never get a new OS on launch, i mean, XP works for me, they should release DX 10 for XP and for some time release all games for both.

Jup, plus the Service Pack 3 will be released. I'm putting a lot of hope on it.

Well if you hadn't had said "XP reigns over Vista" I might not have brought it up, that was a very stupid statement. How can Vista reign over XP when it hasn't even been finished yet, there is no price - what we have is beta builds - Beta builds can't compete with a finished product - Also XP is six years old, vista is far younger.

Alright, but if we don't use the betas as comparison, how can discuss about XP and Vista?

 

[ScottJC]

Bottom line we can't really compare Vista to XP because XP is a more refined product (all the service packs etc) - Vista is still a buggy pile of crap Microsoft are working on till next year.

There are some good things about Vista as well as the bad, Vista's new UI uses vector based graphics to draw its GUI; this is a good thing because no matter how large the screen goes it will always look perfect... ever tried to play a Macromedia Flash file full screen? A normal movie loses its looks when stretched but these look identical to their smaller version.

Vectors all about drawing from one dot to another to draw objects, vectors are awesome - but they cost more hardware time which is one of the reasons why we'll all need to upgrade our graphics cards.

To be honest, i've used the Vista beta - it was quite functional, only reason I ditched it was because I couldn't find drivers for my sound card (Yes i'm lazy).

Speaking of sound, the sound volume control in vista does something i have wanted for years - each application which produces sound is displayed in a list in a nice dialog and you can silence them - so no more annoying Installer music with Vista. yay.

 

[Doomulation]

Althoigh I mentioned Vista was crap, it doesn't mean I will not use it.
Also remember that I doubt DX10 will ever be released for XP because of two reasons:
- It will probably be managed, to work fluently with Vista (which means it will be slow on XP).
- And of course, marketing. Microsoft wants people to upgrade to their newest OS.

 

[Miretank]

There are some good things about Vista as well as the bad, Vista's new UI uses vector based graphics to draw its GUI; this is a good thing because no matter how large the screen goes it will always look perfect... ever tried to play a Macromedia Flash file full screen? A normal movie loses its looks when stretched but these look identical to their smaller version.

Vectors all about drawing from one dot to another to draw objects, vectors are awesome - but they cost more hardware time which is one of the reasons why we'll all need to upgrade our graphics cards.

The GUI seems to be really awesome indeed. I personally like the Aero style. The search option is very impressive - it's for sure a great add for the OS. What keeps me away from Vista is really the hardware requeriments. Of course, if I had a good gpu and more RAM, I would certainly use Vista. But I won't upgrade my PC just for Vista. XP is still good and very useable for my needs. That's why I won't use the new OS (for now of course, who knows the future).
As for the features, Vista will be more flexible than XP imo, but again with a lot of useless things. What will make it unstable will be the low-end hardware I think (on the beginning of XP, lots of people said that it is worst than 98, due it's unstability. But they've said that because they hadn't hardware enough for it - cause any XP runs better 98 on a proper hardware). So, a nice and rich rig will be a need for Windows Vista.

About the sound options, that's very good to hear.

Also remember that I doubt DX10 will ever be released for XP because of two reasons:
- It will probably be managed, to work fluently with Vista (which means it will be slow on XP).

I have thought about it too, I guess DX10 will be coded specially to run on Vista, using it's new graphic capabilities.

- And of course, marketing. Microsoft wants people to upgrade to their newest OS.

Heh, for one moment I forgot that M$ want moniz. :evil:

 

[WhiteX]

The market point is what will possibly turn me off PC gaming in the future, i mean, we will be forced to use Vista to play modern games, will be forced to buy a DX 10 card (which does not exist yet) and will be forced to accept a butt load of DRM to boot.
I, most likely, will have Vista when it turns one year and at that time i do not know how many Vista exclusive games will be released, i just do not have the money to make a major upgrade (GPU and MOBO) just to play Halo 2 and the upcoming Vista exclusive.
As far as DX 10 goes, i have to remind you guys that DX 9C runs on win98 and even DOOM 3 can be twaked to run on it.

 

[Doomulation]

Indeed. But as you probably know also, in the future, hardware required will go down in price and as for the DRM... well, there are pirate copies of XP out there, and there probably will be with Vista as well, with their DRM circuimvented or disabled or alike.

 

[WhiteX]

Yes, and here most of them are pirated, however, the way M$ found to control it was to keep it unsafe to release patches tied to your XP being original, we will have to find other ways to keep ourselves secured in this Virus packed WWW.

 

[Doomulation]

All things can be circuimvented. The fools at ms forgot to actually use multiple keys for the Corporation Edition of XP 64 Pro. Which means, that if you have the key, it is a legitimate version.
Anyway, people WILL find a way around it. We just need to find it.

 

[Miretank]

Btw have you guys seen the prices of Vista? I remember I've seen it somewhere on the net (neowin I think... anyways here's a good link: http://www.neowin.net/index.php?act=view&id=32347), and some of Vista versions will be $400.

 

[Doomulation]

...and some of Vista versions will be $400.

lain:
...
lain:
400 for an OS...
That must be the most expensive OS yet to appear?
Looks like the only way to not get left out is to pirate the OS. Microsoft will probably cut out useful stuff in the cheaper versions.

 

[WhiteX]

He could be talking about our money, the "Real", when launched XP was 400 bucks here, i bet Vista will be the same.

Oh! I just saw the link Mire gave, well, the prices are on the comments, we can´t take that as true.

 

[Miretank]

He could be talking about our money, the "Real", when launched XP was 400 bucks here, i bet Vista will be the same.

400 DOLLARS lain:

Oh! I just saw the link Mire gave, well, the prices are on the comments, we can´t take that as true.

Dunno X, cause there will be a lot of different versions. The cheapest will be the Starter Edition, I think the more expensive will be the Enterprise Edition (old Professional). This not counting on Server, Ultimate (iirc), etc...

 

[WhiteX]

if it comes out at 400 dollars, here, it would be about 1.5 grand, unbuyable.

Starter edition is so cut out that you possibly can´t play a game on it, the home or pro Vista counterparts getting at 400 USD will render piracy a worldwide client base, I believe M$ is very confident on Vista´s anti piracy features to stick such a big pricetag on it.

Once again, i guess i´ll let the good ol´PC get outdated and i´ll prolly get myself some Next gen loving.

 

[Miretank]

Yes, the original version will be damn expensive here.
Plus that, as we know, we'll need to upgrade hardware. So, it's the money of the OS + Hardware.
Does it worth?

Once again, i guess i´ll let the good ol´PC get outdated and i´ll prolly get myself some Next gen loving.

As I said before, if I'd want to play M$ games, I would buy a 360, not a Vista.

 

[WhiteX]

As for the OS money, let´s get realistic...most third worlders, pirate it.irate:

What i do not like are the Vista exclusive games and the mandatory GPU upgrade to play them, i mean Halo 2 is for Xbox, not X360, we will be obligated to get some card that not even exist to play a game that runs on a modified GeF 3.
Such game that can be played on X360, now on a Brazilian game seling website for R$ 1500,00 with included shipping.
Now single player on PC is a rare experience, let alone on action adventure games; 3rd person are extremely scarce, today all we got are FPS´s, RTS´s, MMO´s and Oblivion.
I get more love from my DS than my very expensive PC, why throw more money out in the bin?

EDIT:...Erm, not so much...http://www.gamespot.com/pc/action/devilmaycry3specialedition/news.html?sid=6143489

 

[Blacklord]

My opinion: Vista is a piece of shit. It is the EXACT same thing as XP service pack 3. Microsoft are so shitting themselfs: ooo we made glass transparency. That is the only thing they did add exept IE 7 which is available on XP. Vista is a waste of money.

 

[Doomulation]

It is not the same as SP3. It's a lot of bells and whistles and a whole new foundation and more security, yada yada. But I agree: it will not be worth it for the price.

 

[WhiteX]

If all the games and emus we like to play were released on Linux as well, Windows would be a waste of money.