UltraHLE 2002 Reborn?
- Thread starter aprentice
- Start date
Finally, it is the time for open source.
Now the day has come. We waited and waited, to get our hands with the UltraHLE source code. Years passed by and we prayed for them. But no. the answer from UltraHLE authors was: suffer! Now, when we finally have the source code, illegally obtained as it seems, what do I have to say to the original copyright holders: SUFFER! I DON'T GIVE A SHIT WHAT YOU THINK. THIS PROGRAM IS NOW OPEN SOURCE AND LET THAT BE A REVENGE OR WHATEVER YOU WANT TO CALL IT. TRY TO SUE ANYONE WHO TRIES TO USE YOUR PRECIOUS CODE AND YOU WILL BE DIGGING YOUR OWN CRAVE. THANK YOU.
UltraHLE source code WILL be used. Perhaps it will be licensed under GPL or some other license that makes it *true* software (illegal or not: I don't give a shit anymore, not anymore). Now we get to see what was so cool about UltraHLE and now we (that is, the majority of emulator developers) will also see what is so cool with open source. If (I don't like the word "if"), if the UltraHLE (and Nemu) would have been open source since the beginning, we wouldn't have to wait years to get perfect emulation on N64.
The idea behind open source is so simple: Think about someone inventing a new medicine for some disease and not letting people know how to make it. They would just sell the medicine with their own prices and if they want to quit manufacturing it, they would sell it to the one who is willing to pay big bucks for it (I think this is actually the case today. If you have a heart you know that this ain't right and something must be done).
This is no different of what companies like Microsoft do. This is exactly what emulation authors who make closed source emus do (UltraHLE, Nemu, NESTen, Boycott Advance, you name it). The bad thing, obviously is, that we, the users will have to wait for the new releases. Mailing lists and web-boards are filled up with posts asking: "When will the next release come out?" We may have to wait for months, even years, to get that fine piece of software, and then again, wait another month or two to get the next version since there were some bugs in the current version and we can't use it. How long did you wait UltraHLE 2, or was it 1.5? And it never showed up. What a waste of time and effort.
Yet another thing: closed source programs contain bugs. All of them. In fact, even all open source programs contain bugs. That's not different. But what is different is the fact that if you have the source code (and a permission to make modifications to it), the bugs will be eliminated in a matter of days. Yes, in some cases it can be a matter of hours, this depends on how active the project is. And yes, you don't have to wait to get the source code, it is there for you. You can use it, learn from it. There are no secrets. And still, the original authors hold the copyrights and become famous.
Have you ever used Linux? If you have, you most likely know how good it is. Why it is good? Because Linux is based on open source development. There's nothing we don't know about Linux. The bugs and security holes are eliminated very fast. You don't have to wait for months to get new versions or bugfixes. If the author won't do it, you can do it for yourself, or someone (anyone) else can do it. The program authors do not decide for you when it is the time to release new version, whether this bug should be fixed or not, whether to give some information about the program internals or not. No, instead you decide. The power of open source is that you have the choice! Now the open source is not limited to Linux. In fact, it has been used successfully on many platforms, including Windows.
Think about FCEUltra. FCEUltra has support for Linux, Windows and DOS, and if you wish, you can write support it for Macintosh too. Or any other platform. It is up to *you*. FCEUltra 0.80 was relicensed with GNU General Public License. This means that (unless the author wants to relicense it) you will always be able to get the source code for FCEUltra, you will never have to pay for FCEUltra, and most of all, FCEUltra will be there for you. What if NESTicle would have been open source. I believe that there would be things like NESTicle for Linux, NESTicle v9.0 etc. But NESTicle made its decicion and now it is dead. After a few years, no-one probably remembers it anymore, but still today, NESTicle has some very clever ideas of NES emulation to share with us. At least beginning emulator programmers could learn from it. Now, you can't re-use NESTicle's code, but when if I ever write a NES emu, I will definately consider using FCEUltra's CPU core.
If you still don't understand why you should consider using an open source license in your programs, I can't help. Perhaps you can go to work for Microsoft. Also, it's never too late to start using Linux.
Thanks.
Jipsu
Now the day has come. We waited and waited, to get our hands with the UltraHLE source code. Years passed by and we prayed for them. But no. the answer from UltraHLE authors was: suffer! Now, when we finally have the source code, illegally obtained as it seems, what do I have to say to the original copyright holders: SUFFER! I DON'T GIVE A SHIT WHAT YOU THINK. THIS PROGRAM IS NOW OPEN SOURCE AND LET THAT BE A REVENGE OR WHATEVER YOU WANT TO CALL IT. TRY TO SUE ANYONE WHO TRIES TO USE YOUR PRECIOUS CODE AND YOU WILL BE DIGGING YOUR OWN CRAVE. THANK YOU.
UltraHLE source code WILL be used. Perhaps it will be licensed under GPL or some other license that makes it *true* software (illegal or not: I don't give a shit anymore, not anymore). Now we get to see what was so cool about UltraHLE and now we (that is, the majority of emulator developers) will also see what is so cool with open source. If (I don't like the word "if"), if the UltraHLE (and Nemu) would have been open source since the beginning, we wouldn't have to wait years to get perfect emulation on N64.
The idea behind open source is so simple: Think about someone inventing a new medicine for some disease and not letting people know how to make it. They would just sell the medicine with their own prices and if they want to quit manufacturing it, they would sell it to the one who is willing to pay big bucks for it (I think this is actually the case today. If you have a heart you know that this ain't right and something must be done).
This is no different of what companies like Microsoft do. This is exactly what emulation authors who make closed source emus do (UltraHLE, Nemu, NESTen, Boycott Advance, you name it). The bad thing, obviously is, that we, the users will have to wait for the new releases. Mailing lists and web-boards are filled up with posts asking: "When will the next release come out?" We may have to wait for months, even years, to get that fine piece of software, and then again, wait another month or two to get the next version since there were some bugs in the current version and we can't use it. How long did you wait UltraHLE 2, or was it 1.5? And it never showed up. What a waste of time and effort.
Yet another thing: closed source programs contain bugs. All of them. In fact, even all open source programs contain bugs. That's not different. But what is different is the fact that if you have the source code (and a permission to make modifications to it), the bugs will be eliminated in a matter of days. Yes, in some cases it can be a matter of hours, this depends on how active the project is. And yes, you don't have to wait to get the source code, it is there for you. You can use it, learn from it. There are no secrets. And still, the original authors hold the copyrights and become famous.
Have you ever used Linux? If you have, you most likely know how good it is. Why it is good? Because Linux is based on open source development. There's nothing we don't know about Linux. The bugs and security holes are eliminated very fast. You don't have to wait for months to get new versions or bugfixes. If the author won't do it, you can do it for yourself, or someone (anyone) else can do it. The program authors do not decide for you when it is the time to release new version, whether this bug should be fixed or not, whether to give some information about the program internals or not. No, instead you decide. The power of open source is that you have the choice! Now the open source is not limited to Linux. In fact, it has been used successfully on many platforms, including Windows.
Think about FCEUltra. FCEUltra has support for Linux, Windows and DOS, and if you wish, you can write support it for Macintosh too. Or any other platform. It is up to *you*. FCEUltra 0.80 was relicensed with GNU General Public License. This means that (unless the author wants to relicense it) you will always be able to get the source code for FCEUltra, you will never have to pay for FCEUltra, and most of all, FCEUltra will be there for you. What if NESTicle would have been open source. I believe that there would be things like NESTicle for Linux, NESTicle v9.0 etc. But NESTicle made its decicion and now it is dead. After a few years, no-one probably remembers it anymore, but still today, NESTicle has some very clever ideas of NES emulation to share with us. At least beginning emulator programmers could learn from it. Now, you can't re-use NESTicle's code, but when if I ever write a NES emu, I will definately consider using FCEUltra's CPU core.
If you still don't understand why you should consider using an open source license in your programs, I can't help. Perhaps you can go to work for Microsoft. Also, it's never too late to start using Linux.
Thanks.
Jipsu
GouldFish
New member
Please not another EVERYTHING should be opensource!!
I do a lot of coding BUT I have not let any of the source code out because:
1) I don't want people looking at my code
2) I want to fix my own bugs, I learn more that way.
3) It takes the right mind set to let your work open source, not every one likes to do this. so why should they have people like you burning there ear over it!!
4) using other peoples code leads to making the same mistakes!
Even though this replay has mostly been anti open source I still do beleve in it BUT I also think there is still a need for "closed source" code.
ANY WAY.
I will have some fun with UHLE, starting to look at changing it over to openGL.
I do a lot of coding BUT I have not let any of the source code out because:
1) I don't want people looking at my code
2) I want to fix my own bugs, I learn more that way.
3) It takes the right mind set to let your work open source, not every one likes to do this. so why should they have people like you burning there ear over it!!
4) using other peoples code leads to making the same mistakes!
Even though this replay has mostly been anti open source I still do beleve in it BUT I also think there is still a need for "closed source" code.
ANY WAY.
I will have some fun with UHLE, starting to look at changing it over to openGL.
Ruesselschnurps
The Mad Wombat
I guess it cannot be licensed under any License untill the copyright holders (Epsilon & RealityMan) allow it....
First of all, Ruesselschnurps, I know you can't relicense ultrahle to anything, legally. But I'm quite sure that you can't use it at all - legally. Which is worse: relicensing and distributing it, or just distributing it? I don't think that it matters anymore what we do to it. Anyways, when I think further, there's no reason to GPL it. We have many GPL'ed N64 emus already. And these emus can learn from ultrahle - legally (we'll, at least no one can sue you if you don't use the ultrahle code directly, just learn from it).
Secondly, as a response to GouldFish:
You can do whatever you want. I'm not going to waste my time and effort for developers like you. Go ahead and program your buggy programs. But the users, all the people who want better programs (like n64 emus) faster, listen up: you, and only you have the choice. Don't use these closed source programs. Don't download those buggy EXEs. Instead, choose open software now, and you will not regret it. Here's some programs that you might consider start using, instead of some crappy Windows binaries (I'm sure most of the people already use the emus listed here, which is good):
ZSNES: SNES emu available for Windows, Linux and DOS, source code available in GNU GPL.
FCEUltra: NES emu available for Windows, Linux and DOS, source available in GPL.
Mupen64: upcoming N64 emulator, for many platforms (I don't even know them all, but Windows and Linux are supported at least), source available under GPL.
Secondly, as a response to GouldFish:
You can do whatever you want. I'm not going to waste my time and effort for developers like you. Go ahead and program your buggy programs. But the users, all the people who want better programs (like n64 emus) faster, listen up: you, and only you have the choice. Don't use these closed source programs. Don't download those buggy EXEs. Instead, choose open software now, and you will not regret it. Here's some programs that you might consider start using, instead of some crappy Windows binaries (I'm sure most of the people already use the emus listed here, which is good):
ZSNES: SNES emu available for Windows, Linux and DOS, source code available in GNU GPL.
FCEUltra: NES emu available for Windows, Linux and DOS, source available in GPL.
Mupen64: upcoming N64 emulator, for many platforms (I don't even know them all, but Windows and Linux are supported at least), source available under GPL.
GouldFish
New member
I don't want to labor this but :
most of the emu's you have stated start off life closed source and only went open, when the programers started to get fed up of it
e.g:
Zsnes (they almost stoped)
PJ64 (codes stoped)
and saying that all closed source is buggy and all open source is not is the biggest load of bullshit I have ever read!!!
Linux has bugs in it plus has the worstdriver surport i have ever seen.
but like I said I can see the reasons for having both, I will add that a lot of open source programs seem to lack polish that closed source programs have.
compare Gnome to Explorer XP...
and seconly a lot of people are open sourcing there projects when:
1) it is finished e.g quake/ quakeII
2) or when they stop working on it e.g PJ64.
But enough of this. I say we just leave this now..
most of the emu's you have stated start off life closed source and only went open, when the programers started to get fed up of it
e.g:
Zsnes (they almost stoped)
PJ64 (codes stoped)
and saying that all closed source is buggy and all open source is not is the biggest load of bullshit I have ever read!!!
Linux has bugs in it plus has the worstdriver surport i have ever seen.
but like I said I can see the reasons for having both, I will add that a lot of open source programs seem to lack polish that closed source programs have.
compare Gnome to Explorer XP...
and seconly a lot of people are open sourcing there projects when:
1) it is finished e.g quake/ quakeII
2) or when they stop working on it e.g PJ64.
But enough of this. I say we just leave this now..
RatTrap
GODLIKE
just a few thoughts on the open source thing..
i prefer things to not be open source.. i can't do much about my websites.. bcoz well.. it's to easy to get the html/jscript source how ever much you try to hide it.. eather way.. it don't really cause any trouble.. and the worst i have to deal with is ppl wondering how i did this or that..
i suppose it's pretty much the same with an emu that's open source.. you'll mostly get emails with questions.. or questions on forums about your code maybe.. but the risc that i don't like with open source:
anyone can do very lame things with it.. like edit the code.. redistribute it and eather change gui/name/a few pieces.. and you have a new emu.. the other thing with open source.. are trojans.. there's a few more things.. and sure a whole comunity of coders working on the same code might go faster.. but as an individual.. if i where to start to code an emu.. i would do it for the ride.. not for the result.. as in i would like to do it myself..
the ppl who LOVE open source though are the end users of course.. the only problem with end users is that they most of the time don't seem to get it.. alot of emu authors don't make the emu to give you pleasure.. but to create something and see if they can see it thru.. behind that.. most coders talk to other coders anyways.. ask for help etc.. and i feel that is better.. then open source.. this is what i feel though.. and i know alot of ppl disagree with me..
on the other hand.. if a project is ended.. if the emu author has had enugh.. the release of the source is allways wellcome.. so that someone else can continue it if they want too.. still.. if it was me making an emu.. and i had to quit suddenly.. the source would probably go to very few ppl.. and it would not go out publicly
..
but when it comes
i prefer things to not be open source.. i can't do much about my websites.. bcoz well.. it's to easy to get the html/jscript source how ever much you try to hide it.. eather way.. it don't really cause any trouble.. and the worst i have to deal with is ppl wondering how i did this or that..
i suppose it's pretty much the same with an emu that's open source.. you'll mostly get emails with questions.. or questions on forums about your code maybe.. but the risc that i don't like with open source:
anyone can do very lame things with it.. like edit the code.. redistribute it and eather change gui/name/a few pieces.. and you have a new emu.. the other thing with open source.. are trojans.. there's a few more things.. and sure a whole comunity of coders working on the same code might go faster.. but as an individual.. if i where to start to code an emu.. i would do it for the ride.. not for the result.. as in i would like to do it myself..
the ppl who LOVE open source though are the end users of course.. the only problem with end users is that they most of the time don't seem to get it.. alot of emu authors don't make the emu to give you pleasure.. but to create something and see if they can see it thru.. behind that.. most coders talk to other coders anyways.. ask for help etc.. and i feel that is better.. then open source.. this is what i feel though.. and i know alot of ppl disagree with me..
on the other hand.. if a project is ended.. if the emu author has had enugh.. the release of the source is allways wellcome.. so that someone else can continue it if they want too.. still.. if it was me making an emu.. and i had to quit suddenly.. the source would probably go to very few ppl.. and it would not go out publicly
..but when it comes
Ruesselschnurps
The Mad Wombat
The ZSNES Project ist still alive & kicking....but the big Problems in SNES Emulation have been solved, so there are many little , but hard to solve, problems left .....like Special Fixes for single games......
First, why didn't I include Daedalus, PJ64, 1964, SNES 9x, VirtuaNES etc. in my list. Well, my list was just an example.
The above emus are all good emulators, but the license of PJ64 and SNES 9x is horrible. Let me quote the "Free Software Project Management HOWTO" (found on linuxdoc.org and many other places if you are interested):
"Many people write three or four sentences in a COPYING file and assume that they have written a free software license--as my long experience with the debian-legal mailing professes, this is very often not the case. It may not protect you, it may not protect your software, and it may make things very difficult for people that want to use your software but who pay a lot of attention to the subtle legal points of licenses."
If you don't understand what is the difference having a usual freeware program and a program licensed with an open source license, take a look at the Open Source Definition at: http://www.opensource.org/docs/definition.php
Now, many of you say that it is good that projects that have stopped usually release their source code. This is true, but how much better it would be to have the source code right from the start? Think about it. It took many years to finally get the source code for ZSNES, and when we got it, it didn't take many weeks until we had a fully functional Linux port of ZSNES.
The same would have actually been done for PJ64, since we now have its source. But there's one big problem: PJ64's source is quite useless since
a) it doesn't include the source for the plugins
b) it has its own weird license as described above (well, not weird, but it is very problematic to use PJ64's code in, say, a GPL application since I'm quite sure that PJ64's license is not compatible with GPL, nor is it OSI certified (i.e. certified as a real open source license by OSI).
Currently, open source community is lacking a GBA emulator. Boycott Advance, Visual Boy Advance, and others, being closed source, are almost useless in most unices and you can only hope for a port for Mac or some more excotic platform. (If you know about Unix you know that binaries are almost worthless if you want to gain at least some level of compatability between different platforms). Now, having an open source GBA emu (say, that BoycottAdvance/SDL would be GPL'ed) would be the way to get GBA emulator ported on many platforms. Also, after that it would be easy (for beginners) to program new GBA emulator, just by taking a look at the sources, or using the sources directly.
Let me respond to this: "and saying that all closed source is buggy and all open source is not is the biggest load of bullshit I have ever read!!! Linux has bugs in it plus has the worstdriver surport i have ever seen."
Now, closed source is buggy, so is open source, as I said. But the bugs usually get corrected *much* faster in open source programs, and then, from the end-user point of view, the program works for him and he *does not have to wait for the author to release a bugfix for ages*. Well, if the author of the closed source program works hard, it might even be that the bugfixes are released very fast. But this is not always the case. Also, an end-user who knows some programming, could fix the bug by himself by looking at the source code.
And if you say that Linux has the worst driver support you have ever seen, you are probably right. But I'm typing this text on Mozilla running on a machine with Linux 2.4.0, XFree 4.0.2 and KDE2. All my periphral devices work, including the Epson printer. Now, I could buy, say, an exotic sound card that doesn't have drivers for Linux and then I could come here to blaim Linux for its bad driver support. The bottom line: Linux has enough drivers to support the most common devices and even more.
Now, I have to clear just one more thing up:
"the other thing with open source.. are trojans.." Did I get it right? This guy claims that trojans are a problem in open source. Hah. The trojans are a problem with closed source. You can as easily check the compiled open source program for viruces as you can check a closed source program. The point is that if you have the source, and know what it means, you can be sure that the program doesn't have trojans even without compiling it and checking it out with a virus scanner. With closed source programs, you just have to wonder "What if this contains a trojan and my scanner didn't notice it?". Trojans are a problem with closed source applications. Even some of the Microsoft's programs have them as we all know.
The conclusion:
------------------
It just happens that if we want new emulators, if we want them to be good and portable, if we want them to be free, and most of all, if we want everyone to be able to learn from them, the open source is the only choice. Everything else is just a waste of time. If you want to program for your own good, then do so, but if you want everyone to be able to get the most out of your program, then license them to open source. Share the information, share the fun; that's what open source is about, sharing. Too bad that sharing anything seems to be very hard for the human mind.
The above emus are all good emulators, but the license of PJ64 and SNES 9x is horrible. Let me quote the "Free Software Project Management HOWTO" (found on linuxdoc.org and many other places if you are interested):
"Many people write three or four sentences in a COPYING file and assume that they have written a free software license--as my long experience with the debian-legal mailing professes, this is very often not the case. It may not protect you, it may not protect your software, and it may make things very difficult for people that want to use your software but who pay a lot of attention to the subtle legal points of licenses."
If you don't understand what is the difference having a usual freeware program and a program licensed with an open source license, take a look at the Open Source Definition at: http://www.opensource.org/docs/definition.php
Now, many of you say that it is good that projects that have stopped usually release their source code. This is true, but how much better it would be to have the source code right from the start? Think about it. It took many years to finally get the source code for ZSNES, and when we got it, it didn't take many weeks until we had a fully functional Linux port of ZSNES.
The same would have actually been done for PJ64, since we now have its source. But there's one big problem: PJ64's source is quite useless since
a) it doesn't include the source for the plugins
b) it has its own weird license as described above (well, not weird, but it is very problematic to use PJ64's code in, say, a GPL application since I'm quite sure that PJ64's license is not compatible with GPL, nor is it OSI certified (i.e. certified as a real open source license by OSI).
Currently, open source community is lacking a GBA emulator. Boycott Advance, Visual Boy Advance, and others, being closed source, are almost useless in most unices and you can only hope for a port for Mac or some more excotic platform. (If you know about Unix you know that binaries are almost worthless if you want to gain at least some level of compatability between different platforms). Now, having an open source GBA emu (say, that BoycottAdvance/SDL would be GPL'ed) would be the way to get GBA emulator ported on many platforms. Also, after that it would be easy (for beginners) to program new GBA emulator, just by taking a look at the sources, or using the sources directly.
Let me respond to this: "and saying that all closed source is buggy and all open source is not is the biggest load of bullshit I have ever read!!! Linux has bugs in it plus has the worstdriver surport i have ever seen."
Now, closed source is buggy, so is open source, as I said. But the bugs usually get corrected *much* faster in open source programs, and then, from the end-user point of view, the program works for him and he *does not have to wait for the author to release a bugfix for ages*. Well, if the author of the closed source program works hard, it might even be that the bugfixes are released very fast. But this is not always the case. Also, an end-user who knows some programming, could fix the bug by himself by looking at the source code.
And if you say that Linux has the worst driver support you have ever seen, you are probably right. But I'm typing this text on Mozilla running on a machine with Linux 2.4.0, XFree 4.0.2 and KDE2. All my periphral devices work, including the Epson printer. Now, I could buy, say, an exotic sound card that doesn't have drivers for Linux and then I could come here to blaim Linux for its bad driver support. The bottom line: Linux has enough drivers to support the most common devices and even more.
Now, I have to clear just one more thing up:
"the other thing with open source.. are trojans.." Did I get it right? This guy claims that trojans are a problem in open source. Hah. The trojans are a problem with closed source. You can as easily check the compiled open source program for viruces as you can check a closed source program. The point is that if you have the source, and know what it means, you can be sure that the program doesn't have trojans even without compiling it and checking it out with a virus scanner. With closed source programs, you just have to wonder "What if this contains a trojan and my scanner didn't notice it?". Trojans are a problem with closed source applications. Even some of the Microsoft's programs have them as we all know.
The conclusion:
------------------
It just happens that if we want new emulators, if we want them to be good and portable, if we want them to be free, and most of all, if we want everyone to be able to learn from them, the open source is the only choice. Everything else is just a waste of time. If you want to program for your own good, then do so, but if you want everyone to be able to get the most out of your program, then license them to open source. Share the information, share the fun; that's what open source is about, sharing. Too bad that sharing anything seems to be very hard for the human mind.
RatTrap
GODLIKE
i see alot of your points and i can keep an open mind honestly.. i agree on -some of the things you've said.. but there's more to it then what you seem to have thought about..
you talk mostly of the end-user here.. wich is nothing i give a rats ass about honestly.. and it's not because i'm on the inside and could probably get any beta i wanted.. for one.. i don't ever ask for betas or code.. but i have a few sources of emus that aren't open source.. and i have to say that if you think all the emu-authors create emus for getting some kind of publicity or creating something for you or the comunity.. your very wrong..
your saying that the open source comunity needs this or needs that.. you should still respect the reason why ppl do what they do.. if they don't want to have their emu open sourced.. they won't.. and should'nt be naggd to death to do so eather.. and you should be thankfull that you at least get to use their product coz it has been released publicly.. when they could have kept it for themselfs and their friends only.. you might feel that's selfish.. but you could also say you yourself are being selfish.. wanting the code for something you haven't created.. it sounds more like whining to me ..
and about the trojan thing.. yes i know it's as bad on closed sourced.. but the thing with open source is that any script kid can take a plugin/cheat/crack for a game fairly easy.. and add a type of trojan or snipper or whatever he want's.. this causes too many ppl with these problems.. and sure you could say it's donne on closed source apps too.. but for example on the D2 scene it's seen all the time.. i myself haven't had trouble with it but almost every guy i've met on D2 has had their CD-key and/or acounts hacked bcoz they downloaded maphacks or other things like that..
with closed source it's harder for mere noobs to do things like this.. and most often more hassle.. wich is why open source is'nt something the game developers allways like and warn about.. not only that.. on games where you have the full/part of the source.. you find cheats all over the place.. you rarelly find someone playing the games the way they where originally intended to be played.. mods are great.. but it sure gets out of hand sometimes..
anyways.. there's allways two sides to both these topics.. and you could probably come back with good excuses/reasons not to agree at all with me.. but well.. if your not open minded.. i guess it depends on what side your on..
you talk mostly of the end-user here.. wich is nothing i give a rats ass about honestly
.. and it's not because i'm on the inside and could probably get any beta i wanted.. for one.. i don't ever ask for betas or code.. but i have a few sources of emus that aren't open source.. and i have to say that if you think all the emu-authors create emus for getting some kind of publicity or creating something for you or the comunity.. your very wrong..your saying that the open source comunity needs this or needs that.. you should still respect the reason why ppl do what they do.. if they don't want to have their emu open sourced.. they won't.. and should'nt be naggd to death to do so eather
.. and you should be thankfull that you at least get to use their product coz it has been released publicly.. when they could have kept it for themselfs and their friends only.. you might feel that's selfish.. but you could also say you yourself are being selfish.. wanting the code for something you haven't created.. it sounds more like whining to me ..and about the trojan thing.. yes i know it's as bad on closed sourced.. but the thing with open source is that any script kid can take a plugin/cheat/crack for a game fairly easy.. and add a type of trojan or snipper or whatever he want's.. this causes too many ppl with these problems.. and sure you could say it's donne on closed source apps too.. but for example on the D2 scene it's seen all the time.. i myself haven't had trouble with it but almost every guy i've met on D2 has had their CD-key and/or acounts hacked bcoz they downloaded maphacks or other things like that..
with closed source it's harder for mere noobs to do things like this.. and most often more hassle.. wich is why open source is'nt something the game developers allways like and warn about.. not only that.. on games where you have the full/part of the source.. you find cheats all over the place.. you rarelly find someone playing the games the way they where originally intended to be played.. mods are great.. but it sure gets out of hand sometimes..
anyways.. there's allways two sides to both these topics.. and you could probably come back with good excuses/reasons not to agree at all with me.. but well.. if your not open minded.. i guess it depends on what side your on..
Tri-Force
Philosopher Warrior
for a lot of the people on the boards, ripping into a code is like an addiction. it's a thirst to learn and a thirst to play. the more codes they have to tool with the more the know and the more they have something to do instead of sit around and complain that a code is closed.
RatTrap
GODLIKE
there's alot more -creative- ways to spend your time then doing that.. instead of working on something someone else has made.. why not make something yourself instead.. and if C or whatever is to hard for you.. try something simpler.. all it takes is time.. patience.. dedication.. and determination.. ppl who don't have these things should look elsewhere for a non-waste of time achivement.. especially when it comes to computers.. "in cyberspace.. patience is a true virtue"..
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Can I say something?
Everyone seems to be assuming everyone will flock to UltraHLE and abandon work on the other projects.
I see us getting a few cheap hacks of UltraHLE, which will then die off leaving us with Dominator working on SupraHLE (which he would've done anyway, but much slower) and everyone else working on Project 64, 1964, Nemu64, Daedalus, Mupen64, TR64 or whatever.
Reality Man and Epsilon are gone. They're dust. They couldn't give less of a fuck about what we do. So is Nintendo. They're fretting about upcoming Gamecube emulators (there must be some starting) and how many people are willing to use them. And not forgetting GBA emulators, they're already shitting themselves over VisualBoyAdvance I dare say.
Basically, this source will do good to N64 emulation, giving people with low-end PCs a better emulator than the current UltraHLE/SupraHLE and I'll certainly be using whatever comes up too. You don't like it? Think UltraHLE is past it? Don't like the legality issues? Leave. Go. Ignore this entire topic. Don't let it bother you. Play on your other emulators. Go on. Nothing to see here...
Everyone seems to be assuming everyone will flock to UltraHLE and abandon work on the other projects.
I see us getting a few cheap hacks of UltraHLE, which will then die off leaving us with Dominator working on SupraHLE (which he would've done anyway, but much slower) and everyone else working on Project 64, 1964, Nemu64, Daedalus, Mupen64, TR64 or whatever.
Reality Man and Epsilon are gone. They're dust. They couldn't give less of a fuck about what we do. So is Nintendo. They're fretting about upcoming Gamecube emulators (there must be some starting) and how many people are willing to use them. And not forgetting GBA emulators, they're already shitting themselves over VisualBoyAdvance I dare say.
Basically, this source will do good to N64 emulation, giving people with low-end PCs a better emulator than the current UltraHLE/SupraHLE and I'll certainly be using whatever comes up too. You don't like it? Think UltraHLE is past it? Don't like the legality issues? Leave. Go. Ignore this entire topic. Don't let it bother you. Play on your other emulators. Go on. Nothing to see here...
EddyB43
British Old Gamer
Bleem was killed by Sony because it incorporated the PSX BIOS and was earning money from their code.
As for RealityMan, last we heard he was still working on his Jaguar emulator, Jagulator. If that ever appears it will be a miracle, since it's 5 parallel processor setup makes the 2 CPU Saturn look like a walk in the park to emulate.
As for RealityMan, last we heard he was still working on his Jaguar emulator, Jagulator. If that ever appears it will be a miracle, since it's 5 parallel processor setup makes the 2 CPU Saturn look like a walk in the park to emulate.
tooie
New member
if you want to have a good read about the legality of emulation then read the website at http://www.emuhq.com/emufaq/
Emulation: Right or Wrong?
aka "The EmuFAQ"
Emulation: Right or Wrong?
aka "The EmuFAQ"