Torrent Question

[Melonman64]

Alright, so, you probably think this is another n00b question, but you are wrong. The other day I got torrents for some games I have because I wanted to run them on PC because I thought it would be cool. Well, I found some PC games that were torrents. Are these illegal? Thanks!

 

[Clements]

If these are commercial games, then it is as legal as going to your local game shop and stealing them off the shelves, obviously.

 

[Melonman64]

I figured that would probably be it, but maybe I will find a loophole. There has to be some sort of loophole somewhere.

 

[Allnatural]

No, no loopholes. Theft is theft.

 

[smcd]

Technically downloading movies, software, books, and music, etc. isn't theft, it's copyright infringement - a civil offense (just because you download something doesn't mean you would buy if you didn't download it - thus cannot consitute a loss in revenue, just a possible loss). Theft, taking physical items which can represent a monetary loss, is a criminal offense. The MPAA/RIAA would like you to get those confused though.

I don't condone such things *whistles* but lots of people download stuff as a "try before you buy." If you look at sales, lots of markets have either remained steady or even increased. (maybe if it didn't cost friggin $8 a movie ticket and another $12 for condiments they'd not have to worry with people downloading cammed versions of movies - stupid MPAA). I encourage you to support the developers, artists, writers, whatever the case may be - "if you like it, buy it."

< /end rant >

 

[Jaz]

If these are commercial games, then it is as legal as going to your local game shop and stealing them off the shelves, obviously.

Good one. Made me grin at least.

 

[Allnatural]

Technically downloading movies, software, books, and music, etc. isn't theft, it's copyright infringement - a civil offense

Thank you for the lesson in semantics.

 

[Melonman64]

well, that clears a few things up, but I guess this ends my use of torrents for games that are still sold

 

[smegforbrain]

Thank you for the lesson in semantics.

Well, it gave me a chuckle, but seth has a point: the groups out there are so trying to blur the issue of what is what, that most people don't know.

 

[Allnatural]

Well, it gave me a chuckle, but seth has a point: the groups out there are so trying to blur the issue of what is what, that most people don't know.

Yeah, it's the evolution of the old "you must delete this rom within 24 hours" crap.

 

[Eagle]

well, that clears a few things up, but I guess this ends my use of torrents for games that are still sold

another misconception, copyrights last far longer than the length of time in which a game is sold. So downloading a game that is no longer on the shelf is still illegal. Most of what people call abandonware is not abandoned. Only a few formerly comercial games have been publicly released for free download.

 

[smcd]

another misconception, copyrights last far longer than the length of time in which a game is sold. So downloading a game that is no longer on the shelf is still illegal. Most of what people call abandonware is not abandoned. Only a few formerly comercial games have been publicly released for free download.

Personally I see this as complete abuse of copyright law. If a game is no longer commercially viable, it should be dumped into the public domain. Copyright law should never have been extended to 70+ years, but been 3-5 years with optional renewal if you filled out the paperwork *every* time for *every* item you wanted to reprotect. Oh well, since I have no control over corporate controlled US of A, my opinion matters not.

 

[Eagle]

Personally I see this as complete abuse of copyright law. If a game is no longer commercially viable, it should be dumped into the public domain. Copyright law should never have been extended to 70+ years, but been 3-5 years with optional renewal if you filled out the paperwork *every* time for *every* item you wanted to reprotect. Oh well, since I have no control over corporate controlled US of A, my opinion matters not.

No, that makes no sense because you don't have to register something with the government for it to be copyrighted. If you can prove you thought of it first then you have legal copyrights.

Think of it this way, if I have an idea for a book for example. I write the book from my own ideas, sell the book and then I decide to pull it off the shelves. Does that give you the right to write the sequel using MY characters that were MY idea and then make money off of it? This is why copyrights last so long, because often, compaines come back and decide to reuse their ideas after long periods of time. Look at Doom for another example. Just because ID waited so long for the 3rd installment, doesn't mean that they should lose the rights to it and have some third party come in and make it instead without their approval. In short, copyrights don't just prevent you from making copies of games, they prevent other people from profiting off of your ideas.

 

[smegforbrain]

In short, copyrights don't just prevent you from making copies of games, they prevent other people from profiting off of your ideas.

I agree with what you say, Eagle, but what I think seth meant was that when a specific game no longer becomes viable, that the game itself should become public domain, not sequels, etc.

Like, for example, Doom. That could be public domain, because the systems it was originally designed for (Win98, older game consoles) are no longer on the market.

It doesn't stop ID from doing sequels, but the orginal itself is a free for all.

However, to put a hole in seth's idea, you have situations like Nintendo, where they've taken a game that was out of print for the NES 10-15 years ago, and have now rereleased it for the GBA.

So, there's no easy way to go about it, even if everybody was in favor of it.

 

[CKemu]

So wait, let me see, it gets old / no longer made and everyone is entitled to it for free. Bunch of cheap ass bastards! So don't tell me, they don't make the Mini Cooper S any more, well suppose it should be free then. !950-60s house, well don't make them anymore, lets have that free, oh look they don't make that version of Barbie anymore...gotta have that free.

Why do people try to justify or skirt round what is blatently illegal. Your downloading something that is meant to be bought, your breaking the law, no buts, no if's it blatently fucking clear that your breaking the law....but mommy what if.....and your honour surely if you look at it from this...... Your breaking the law, get over it.

The trick in most cases is to be honest and buy the stuff, trust me it's a nice feeling owning it (/me hugs his mint FF6 cart....) or be clever and try to get away with it.

 

[smcd]

I buy stuff (have the complete castlevania collection for gameboy/gameboy advance in mint condition for example), and think copyright is a good idea but currently very poorly implemented. People have a right to make money from their products, but when they aren't available for retail purchase anymore what's the harm in sharing it? I don't mean go off and download everything for free, but for example old Atari 2600 games - these haven't been on the market for YEARS, what's the harm? Sure, they've released a few of these games on CD or for various consoles to "remember the classics" but often times ports just dont have the same "feel"