Nintendo "to go Sega-like"?

[RatTrap]

ok.. i'll go back to topic..


the reason we still want faster computers is bcoz they are still "slowable".. you can slow a computer down just by running 3 heavy programs or by simply putting on a game.. you all know.. that one day there will be computers powerfull enugh to do anything we ask of them.. and it will be donne so fast.. that we won't even have time to think of what to do next b4 it's finished.. today.. we are waiting on the computers to load.. to do this.. or to do that.. in the future i believe.. 1 computer.. might just be waiting for the whole world to press enter.. for what seems to us as just 1 second.. might seem like a lifetime to the computer.. they will be so incredibly fast.. and able to handle so many tasks at the same time.. that we even in our dreams won't need a better computer.. if we need to know the rout to god knows where in the galaxy.. you'll ask it and it will respond imedietly.. if you wanna play the most recent game that has been created.. you'll be able to do so and the computer won't even use a tenth of it's full capacity.. also.. who are you kidding really.. WE have limits.. if a human being was exposed to an environment that was SO amazing and sureal and complex and incredibly diferent.. i bet most of us would go nutz.. or lol.. who knows maybe even explode.. the comuters would probably be able to handle the calculations with their hands tied behind their backs but we won't be able to keep up with it.. sure there's a million questions to answer.. but who's to say we never will know everything.. so even if there is no limit to where we'll build computers.. we won't need better computers one day.. unless your some goverment agency.. and who knows maybe they won't need a better one then what you have at home eather.. coz it'll probably overpowerfull even for a job like that.. who knows.. maybe in the end there will be 1 computer in the whole planet.. taking care of the whole planets population all at the same time.. i just hope it isn't like Marvin the Robot.. that would be one sad planet hehe..

and btw.. the 2012 thing was just an example.. geez.. you guys should look at what i'm trying to explain instead of taking everything so literally..

 

[Tri-Force]

Imagine if you will a man who lives in a one bedroom appartment. make that a one room appartment. the living room doubbles as a kitchen/bathroom. he has a small refridgerator next to his toilet/sink and his bed/tub is on the other side of the room next to his television/stove.
One day on his way home from begging for food, the man decides to spend the money he claims he was going to spend on coffee on a lottery ticket. And guess what. . . HE WINS (if he didn't the story would be pointless) $10,000,000.
Now the man so the man moves out of his hole in the ground to Master P's home (you all saw it on MTV cribs right?) This house is HUGE. everything he owned in his old house can fit on the front porch. in fact, the whole HOUSE can fit on the front porch.
So what do you think the man does? OF COURSE! he buys bigger things that take up more space. things that look nicer and cost more money. things that use more power to run and would have blown the circuit in his old home. he is amazed at the fact that he can iron WITH THE LIGHTS ON. this completely blows his mind. what amazes him more is that he doesn't have to unplug the fridge to watch TV. YIPPIE!!!
one day the man decides that he needs a refridgerator that can also help his kids do their homework while fixing them snacks(yes the man has kids now because he's rich so he got a wife and got laid) so he unpacks the un necessary appliance and finds that it has 3 cords to plug into 2 differen't outlets. so he plugs the first one in and the machine introduces it self as "FridgerNanny" and tells him how to set up the rest of the un necessary appliance. so he follows the rest of the instructions and plugs the other two plugs in. GREAT. everything is working fine and dandy and the kids are getting all A+++'s in school while eating healthy.
A few months later the millionare family runs out of clothes to wear(they only wear things once then donate them to charities) so they go shopping. when they get home with their new clothes the man calls the maid to iron the clothes and put them in the closets.
so the maid comes down the elevator, takes out the SuperTurbo Auto Starch Self Cleaning Remote Control No Burn Fast Heat Auto Charge Iron and plugs it in. OH CRAP. THE LIGHTS WENT OUT!!!!
so the man buys a bigger house AND his own power plant and thinks that will be enough. but then he buys a TV that also Teaches the kids how to SkateBoard and Make Pizza. and of course the next time he irons all his clothes the lights go out again and he buys another power plant and pushes THAT one to it's limit too. and so on and so on.


the point of the story is that when computers get faster and better so to applications. the more memory you have the more you use. the more speed you have the more you need. in the year 2012 that annoying Paperclip guy in MS word will probally be Holographic and speak every language and maybe even actcually HELP you. that's going to take a lot of Memory and Processing power.of course the computers of that day will be able to handle it. they will probally have 3000 GB hard drives. but the applications will be as big as 2000MB each so the memory will be used as quickly as it is today and we will still get the annoying smurf screen telling us to ctrl+alt+delete to restart or hit any other key to continue.
The more space we have the more space we use and the more space we use the more space we need.

 

[DuDe]

Yeah, that`s a Murphy law.

 

[RatTrap]

your still stuck on the 2012 thing.. 2012 was an example year.. not the actual year we would all have the stuff i talked about..

and your also stuck on one other thing.. you believe we humans have no limit.. when we of course do.. i never said computers would reach their limit.. it would be a "limit" but it would'nt be their limit.. of course there will allways be better computers available on the market.. and i'm sure many ppl with enugh money who don't got anything more to spend it on might buy them.. but i'm saying when we reach a sertain personal limit for us humans.. when the day comes that we don't need to buy better computers coz they'll be able to do anything we tell them to do.. even iron a silk big ass sail with all the settings you could possible think of and even make up some new ones.. while your making the same computer make a map of the entire universe in atomic precision.. without the lights even flickering.. when the day comes when you can't come up with something harder to make it do.. when it can do exactly anything you could ever come up with.. will you still go and buy a new computer?.. do you think the rest of the world would?.. and when you get to this point in the history of the world.. don't you think by then most ppl would have stoped buying the latest computers?.. since the computers they had 10 years ago can do everything they ask them to do and so much more without even using a fraction of their capacity?.. don't you think that is a "limit".. sertainly not the computers limit.. but the consumers limit?.. you honestly don't agree on that?..

 

[Tri-Force]

ok first i know that 2012 is just an example year. but for the sake of keeping everything in perspective i used the same year you used. i KNOW that the kind of computer you are talking about is FAR FAR FAR from being a reality. that said. . .
as humans we tend to want something better than what the next guy has. be it shoes, shirts, cars sitting on all chrome dubs. whatever it may be we want ours to be better than the other guys. so even if the day DOES come when computers stop freezing (which I highly doubt) people will still go out and buy the latest model because someone else wont have it. lets use the example of cars.
I can go out and buy a new Kia Rio which has crank windows, cloth seats and pull up push down locks for $9,095 and get to and from work every day fine and dandy. or i can go out and buy a Jaguar S type with the navagation system that i'll probally never use with wood paneling and leather seats with lumbar support, frickin RAIN SENSING windsheild wipers and more crap i wont use and sitting on 20" all chrome rims for about $62,400. what do you think im going to buy? WHAT YOU DONT HAVE.
and i think you missed my point about how when space increases so does the size of the applications and the amount of FREE space the applications need to run. so unless you're talking about a super computer with unlimited memory then we will always have a need to upgrade.
here is the best example i can think of. EVERY old 8bit nintendo game can probally fit on 1 or 2 game cube discs. but some NEW games will probally need or 4 discs for ONE game. size increase, quality increase, space runs out. sure a super computer of tommorrow will be able to run DOS with ease but the applications that it will be developed for and the applications that will be developed for it will run on it like applications run on our computers today.

 

[RatTrap]

actually your very wrong on that last part.. if you know games.. you know that games are getting smaller.. not bigger.. in filesize yes.. why?.. bcoz if your supercomputer can do realtime rendering with all the special effects that some machines are starting to be able to do today.. you won't need to take up space on movies.. alot of games are starting to use the internal 3d engine for it's animations.. wich has made the size of alot of games MUCH smaller.. just look at all the n64 games that do that and tell me i'm wrong.. if you look at GC games.. am i wrong?.. i know i'm not.. you'll see more and more games using the internal 3d engine for all that type of things.. in the end.. it'll be all about software.. not hardware.. you might still upgrade stuff but i doubt will be upgrading hardware for ever and ever.. i strongly doubt that.. software is another thing.. but i think it'll be more like downloading a new skin then like downloading and reinstalling a new updated OS.. things are gonna become simpler.. not harder.. and simplicity allways tries to make things become smaller.. and more suficient.. we've also started to do compression in our computer hardware allready.. new cards that are on the way will include real nice texture compressions that will make the textures take less than half the space they take up now in memory.. i bet soon we'll have some kind of file compression in our CPU's or Momma-boards.. it'll be there working like crazy and we won't even notice it.. so one day maybe the programs that take hald your harddrive space might take 1/4th.. and i think once that starts (wich i believe allready has).. we'll probably keep working on that too.. and who is to say that 1 gig won't be enugh.. maybe if that type of technology goes really far it could be..

the trueth is we don't really know how the future will be.. only thing we can say for sure.. is that there is no limit for technology.. but just bcoz there allways be something better.. it won't mean that everyone will buy it.. not the day we are all content at least.. wich i guess is to much for you to imagine..

 

[AlphaWolf]

Know what I think?

So far as hardware goes, moores law will eventualy get to you (be it in 10 years or 20 years or 30 years or even 1000 years) as you can only push the laws of physics so far. Now the software is pretty much limitless, much like the ammount of music there will ever be would seem limitless. Likewise, I bet that until graphics in video games is indistinguishable with, say, photorealism, I doubt anybody will stop in that area. In fact, once that is achieved then the best video game won't be the one with the best graphics.

And I also bet that when that day comes, PCs, video game consoles, and all other personal use devices will be all in the same.

Origionaly posted by Tri-Force
even if the day DOES come when computers stop freezing (which I highly doubt)

Well you have to remember that your beloved video game console is a computer.

 

[RatTrap]

i don't know about the hardware.. i think it'll be limitless somehow.. so many new things are still out there to discover.. for instance there is something faster than light.. darkness (in theory).. there's a million things out there that could make things faster that we might not even know of today and won't even know about for several years now.. and maybe in 40 years those things won't just be theories anymore.. but science that you'll be able to grab and use..

the rest of what your saying is pretty much the same as i've said b4.. so i agree..

 

[Tri-Force]

what i was talking about with games getting bigger was the actcual file size. you cant fit a GC game onto a NES cartridge.

 

[Tri-Force]

Well you have to remember that your beloved video game console is a computer.

*Cough*XBox*Cough*

 

[DuDe]

Every game console is a computer at its core. It has RAM, a GFX card, a CPU, some peripherials, even network adapters... Some are closer to PC`s, some are less, but they are all computers at their core.

 

[Stalkid64]

*Cough*XBox*Cough*

Hey! Thats supposed to be my line!

 

[DuDe]

Don`t worry Stalkid, you`ll always be our favourite fanboy

 

[Tri-Force]

i *coughed* XBOX becasue AlphaWolf responded to me saying this

"even if the day DOES come when computers stop freezing (which I highly doubt) "

 

[RatTrap]

i know you where talking about filesize.. but the thing is.. if compression keeps going the way it's going.. one day you might be able to fit Baldurs Gate into a NES cartridge..

and making games smaller thru taking out the movies in the games and making the 3dengine do the work is reaaaally bringing down the size in games right now..

5 years ago i bought The11thHour(the sequel to The7thGuest).. today.. with a GF4 you could do the whole 7thGuest(a very good looking game at it's time) game in real time without any prerendered video.. i bet in 5 years you'll be able to do the whole 11thHour(it's far more advanced 3d grafix than a GF4 can handle in realtime today) the same way as you could make The7thGuest today.. and instead of it taking 4 CD's.. it'll take 1.. and most probably not even the whole CD.. a 3d Scene like that of the whole house in The7thGuest would take about 50-80 MB.. the 3d engine to be used would take about the same.. and then the textures and sounds would take about 300MB.. imagine all of this compressed..a 3d scene compresses pretty well.. the textures and sounds would compress pretty well too.. the rest of the programing and ingame could probably be very well compressed too.. if you ask me.. you could fit a game like The7thGuest from 7-8 years ago into about 200MB today.. and you could probably make it even look better.. and be real time instead of how it used to be..

tell me you think we're gonna be stuck where we are today in 5 more years and that we won't go down in filesize.. and i will get up from my chair and go over there and spank you ..

 

[Jaz]

Don`t worry Stalkid, you`ll always be our favourite fanboy

Of the 'Box?! *LOL* Read up your facts..

 

[Tri-Force]

file size will go down but people will want to use all the space they have to make the most outrageous game anyone has ever seen so games will be the same size. movies will become more interactive within the games because you CAN now. it's like this. say you want to write a letter to chick you want and you have a lot of things to say to try to convince her that you're not just some computer geek. but you only have one piece of paper. so you write what you gotta say and you get the basic gist of your thoughts down. then someone with better handwriting comes along and re writes your letter in a smaller font so that now it only takes half the page. so what do you do. Elaborate and use every piece of space you have.

you're still missing my point though. yah,file compression is a thing of today. and yah someday you will probally be able to fit OOT AND MM on a GBAA(AAAA) cartridge for all the grand kids to play and tell them storys about the little man and his brother who used to ride a Dinosour and save the princess. I dont doubt that. I am right there with you on the idea that that is a fact. file compression will make TODAYS games smaller. but when given extra space you're going to use the extra space. games will be longer at the same file size they are at today.but when you talk about making FFXXX (No Aeris isn't naked) you will want to make it longer and better with enhanced everything and voiced actors in Multi Languages in one McChip (that's what games will be on) the file size is going to be twice the size of a game today but 4 times as good. look to the FUTURE.

 

[RatTrap]

abount language and sound.. this isn't really future stuff.. this is going on right now.. not in your home of course.. at least not yet for a few years.. but there are sound vocabulary processors being built still that are getting better and better.. what's to say that all the things the characters say to eachother in the game that now use alot of space in wave files and mp3s won't be some type of just be a type of text that the computer reads thru and makes the characters say.. the ideal thing in games will be to have the machine do all the anoying work.. like facial expresions and movements while talking.. the game designer will make a game and adjust all the amounts of settings the character will have.. like voice pitch etc etc.. so the machine will just simply read the manuscript and connect it with the chars voice and viola.. we got what they are actually trying to do today.. and if you while playing the game.. want to hear him talk in some weird ass language from outerspace.. the machine will do this for you while your playing the game.. it'll just translate the manuscript.. hey.. now we went from 150 MB in sound files to 10 MB in manuscript space .. see my point?.. how ever you see it.. things will find a way to get smaller.. untill we have so much space in one SuperUltraDVD2Turbo that you can fitt the whole universe inside it.. and still have space to install UT3002 .. not only coz of the expanded space.. but also coz of the compression.. and god knows which other inventions i can't even begin to imagine just yet..

 

[DuDe]

Of the 'Box?! *LOL* Read up your facts..

Oh no, I meant that he`s a ninty fanboy, I forgot to write it...
Anyway, when I think about it, the pun wasn`t that good in the first place...

 

[AlphaWolf]

Tri-Force:

I am not sure why your pulling the xbox into this, as its still just a game console, but to top that, what exactly do you mean by computers freezing anyways? Kind of a rough, one sided statement. My windows 2000 system was running 8 weeks strait at one time (and this was an all gaming system) before I changed a video driver and a restart was necessary. It never crashed/froze unless I did something out of the ordinary (e.g. overclocked it).

Like I said you gotta remember, they are all in the same at heart. They are both just devices that perform thousands/millions of complex mathematic instructions per second.