Probably old news but I mean ouch!

[NeoNight]

http://www.gamespot.com/all/news/news_6089247.html

all I can say is :ph34r: :gunman: :borg: :linux: :crazy: (erm yeah thats about it)

[dukenukem]

Damn man too bad for him and that group,i have seen some of their releases,man he will be paying that cash for the rest of his life:(.

[CrzCorvette]

i have some Razor1911 games :(

[jollyrancher]

Well, you're gonna get caught selling $500,000 in pirated software over the net... I doubt he will ever pay the fine... well at least until the day OJ pays the full $20 mil settlement. I knew a guy who almost got busted "phreaking" on pay phones in our junior high... but at least he knew that he was doing something really stupid and didn't keep it on his computer.

[Trotterwatch]

Serves him right :) You do that kind of shit you take the risks.

[khanmeister]

Serves him right :) You do that kind of shit you take the risks.

For game piracy? Ridiculously over fined/sentenced.

[2fast4u]

Serves him right :) You do that kind of shit you take the risks.

seconded. and i think khanmeister, you should read the article more closely. appearantly there was a lot more to it than just game piracy :)

[vampireuk]

For game piracy? Ridiculously over fined/sentenced.

Not at all, people who sell pirated software are scum. I hate how they get it for free then start trying to make money off it. I have no problem with groups that release stuff for free, selling it is just lame.

[khanmeister]

Not at all, people who sell pirated software are scum. I hate how they get it for free then start trying to make money off it. I have no problem with groups that release stuff for free, selling it is just lame.

I guess I'd have to agree that the whole "illegal software ring" and commercial aspect of it are punishable, and maybe rightly so, but seriously: FOUR YEARS? Jesus! That's a significant portion of your life getting corn holed in a concrete box. Plus then having to settle this massive debt after your release? I'd go nuts and start wacking people when I got out.

[vampireuk]

It will give them a long time to think about what they did, selling pirated material is completly wrong.

[AlphaWolf]

For game piracy? Ridiculously over fined/sentenced.

So you are saying that if somebody basically stole $700,000 worth of your money, you wouldn't want it back?

Keep in mind that this fine didn't come from software piracy alone, he defrauded cisco out of that money; he stole it from them, and one way or another they will get it back from him.

And that four year sentence was light, people can do much more than that for the amount that he stole.

[khanmeister]

So you are saying that if somebody basically stole $700,000 worth of your money, you wouldn't want it back?

Keep in mind that this fine didn't come from software piracy alone, he defrauded cisco out of that money; he stole it from them, and one way or another they will get it back from him.

And that four year sentence was light, people can do much more than that for the amount that he stole.

Dunno, Grand Theft Auto is usually only a year, and some cars are worth $700,000, so even compared to other punitive laws, precedent, you know. Pretty stiff, probably because some female judge has an anti-technology bias or some such thing. Let's make an example of this hacker and stop script kiddies! Seems silly to me.

[Trotterwatch]

Pretty stiff, probably because some female judge has an anti-technology bias or some such thing. Let's make an example of this hacker and stop script kiddies! Seems silly to me.

Do you come from another planet?

This person knew what he was getting into, he knew the risks. I hardly think a year in jail would have been sufficient punishment, or deterrent.

[2fast4u]

in the end its kinda like robbing a few dozen game stores and selling the goods..

[khanmeister]

Do you come from another planet?

This person knew what he was getting into, he knew the risks. I hardly think a year in jail would have been sufficient punishment, or deterrent.


Do you know anyone personally who has spent a year in a US jail?

A year is super rough for a crime that in the end, was largely financial, and not violent in any way. Kenneth Lay gets off way better, think about that!

I don't justify or condone any of these guys actions, that would make me criminally insane. However, four years inside will probably turn this guy into a hardened killer if he makes it out. One year could scare him straight.

I don't know too many theft crimes than i consider worth over a year of somebody's life, asside from maybe stealing old people's retirements, and bankrupting a state government (see Kenneth Lay reference).

[AlphaWolf]

Dunno, Grand Theft Auto is usually only a year, and some cars are worth $700,000, so even compared to other punitive laws, precedent, you know.

Well, in arizona law, if you look nya (http://www.azleg.state.az.us/FormatDocument.asp?inDoc=/ars/13/01814.htm&Title=13&DocType=ARS), you'll notice that stealing a car is a class 3 felony (and that even includes a $500 peice of shitcar.) If you look over nya (http://www.azleg.state.az.us/FormatDocument.asp?inDoc=/ars/13/00702.htm&Title=13&DocType=ARS), then you'll notice that a class 3 felony is a minimum of 2.5 years in prison, which can go all the way up to 7 years. The judge can adjust the sentence based on the cost of the car if he wants to, but it must be at least 2.5 years.



I don't justify or condone any of these guys actions, that would make me criminally insane. However, four years inside will probably turn this guy into a hardened killer if he makes it out. One year could scare him straight.


What are you basing this on?

[vampireuk]

Khan they were stupid enough to do all that, they knew what they were getting into and are fucking stupid for doing it.

[khanmeister]

Khan they were stupid enough to do all that, they knew what they were getting into and are fucking stupid for doing it.

That seems pretty hard core for a crime that was non-violent. That's all I'm saying. Some armed robbers get off easier, and that is a scarier concept to me, that takes a scarier individual.

Wolf: I've known a few people who went in for minor things and came out, "different". There is alot of evidence to support the fact that our prisons don't always help correct negative behaviors. The Arizona law puts things in perspective, thank you!

[jollyrancher]

Well I'm not sure the penalty is enough... remember that Milken guy who swindeled millions of dollars, went to jail for a short time and then got out and still has countless millions stashed in secret places... I'd say it was worth it... so if you can steal lots of money and live a lavish lifestyle with even less repurcussions, what's going to stop people? Morals???

[AlphaWolf]

That seems pretty hard core for a crime that was non-violent. That's all I'm saying. Some armed robbers get off easier, and that is a scarier concept to me, that takes a scarier individual.


That depends on the criminals' motives. Did he intend to kill? Or just intend to rob about $200 worth of goods? That is a lot less than .7 million.



Wolf: I've known a few people who went in for minor things and came out, "different".

Thats the whole point.



There is alot of evidence to support the fact that our prisons don't always help correct negative behaviors.

So what should we do? Just let them go scott free? If anything, I believe prisons need to be more rough on the inmates. I remember when I was in basic combat training, there were several trainees with me who had been in prison before, and they were saying that being in prison is much easier than the shit they put us through. They get cable TV along with many luxuries, and it costs them nothing to boot.

[smegforbrain]

Khan seems to be following the "Stealing is good, mmkay" motto.

Not a good one to follow.

[khanmeister]

Khan seems to be following the "Stealing is good, mmkay" motto.

Not a good one to follow.

HA HA. Definitely not. I was merely pointing out that people who carry weapons and the potential to kill, and people who steal old people's retirements, deserve longer harsher prison sentence. Even though this guy had a modicum of success in his software piracy scam, he seems pretty small time to me.

Also, when I said they come out "different", I meant they come out potentially much MUCH more dangerous. :alien2:

It seems a shame to send this guy, who (though a criminal and in need of therapy, be it prison or otherwise) was basically a petty thief to prison where he can learn to be a cold hard calculated bastard. Over a couple thousand computer games. It seems silly when child molestors, gang bangers, and dirty politicians ALL get off easier.

He's still a criminal and needs punishment, I wasn't debating that.

[Talas]

I have to defend Khan. I too think that the judge should have rather put him in jail for a year and after that let him work off all the money he robbed from the companies. Let him clean the shit of Elephants in Zoos or something like that.

And of course, let someone control his access to the internet and forbid it. :-) That will hit him harder than any punishment.

[Alchy]

I think he would have got off a lot lighter if he hadn't got 700k worth of hardware bills in his lap. That's serious fraud.

I was under the impression razor were just a release group, not a commercial operation making accurate duplicates (boxed with covers etc). If they were the latter, lock 'em up, they knew the consequences and chose to take the risk. If they were just spreading games around the net, I'd give a much lighter sentence (excepting the hardware fraud, of course). Just the bill would have been enough - he'd never touch warez again in his life.