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Super Mario Sunshine!

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Stalkid64

Citizen(sixty)four
(Note: This really does belong on this forum, as topic may vary too much for it to belong in the obscure `Gaming`forum... it also gets a bigger discussion going.)

Well, two very long nights and countless daytime hours later I have to say... THIS is the kind of thing I bought a GameCube for. Superbly addictive gameplay all wrapped up in beautiful visuals and audio that stand out from the crowd.
For anyone who, like me, was expecting what would essentially be Mario 64 with bells and whistles and not a lot more (not a bad thing as such), be prepared for quite a shock.
Mostly because oh damn is this game bloody hard at times. Not in the bad, frustrating "oh look, I'm dead again because I didn't know that was going to happen. Now I'll have to play for half an hour just to get back there" way of Resident Evil, but simply because it seems to require a lot more skill than anything has done for years. I'm sure people will agree that at points Mario Sunshine becomes and redefines the meaning of `hardcore` for modern platform gaming. And quite where some of the more bizarre and surreal parts of the game come from... well, let's just wonder what exactly Miyamoto-san grows in his garden. Watermelon festival? Abstract `crayon-drawn 2D` animated skyboxes (2D Trains and planes...)? Squid racer?
Post your favourite or even least favourite (if that's even possible) things from the game here... now! Try not to be too spoiler-ish though, k?
Me, I'm sticking with the water as standout feature right now... Ocean + turbo nozzle = jaw-drop.
Also, new for discussion - Is The Legend of Zelda actually running on the same engine as Mario Sunshine..? Just look at the palm trees in particular and generally clear, sharp but simple visuals. Remember (for anyone who hasn't seen this months NGC Magazine)... Zelda IS NOT actually cel-shaded. The cel-shading technique technically refers in part to the JSR/JGR method of `black outlines around characters etc.`Which Zelda has none of. In fact, aside from the water and the higher-than-usual standard animation, if you watch the videos closely you see it's more like a normal 3D game with exceptionally crafted models and simpler textures.
And in fact, looks a huge deal like Mario Sunshine. Mario 64 and Zelda:TOoT shared their game engines too... it would make sense to lower development times if they used the Mario Sunshine engine as well. Anyone who has seen the sunflowers outside Pinna Park will understand where the debate on this came from, as well as why the technique used in the cut scenes may be giving something away.
 

blizz

New member
(note there already is a thread in the gaming forum)

having said that I like the old school levels without the water pack ;)
 

Reznor007

New member
If everyone remembers right, all the previous Mario and Zelda games(with the exception on OOT/MM) have been rather cartoony looking.

And Super Mario Sunshine kicks ass. If anyone doesn't like it, then there must be something wrong with them.
 

yogaman

Banned
well, erm as far as I can remember a review on tv, mario has to clean an island and to rescue the princess from a phony. IMO the graphics look really nice but I don't see that big change from Mario64 ....
Also Luigis Manson is more of a ghostbuster sequel....
 
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Stalkid64

Stalkid64

Citizen(sixty)four
yogaman said:
I though GCN was designed to target the "younger" people aka children :)
No no NO! The N G C was designed to target everyone, as was said many many times. Particularly those who like a bit more quality in their games.
Incidentally I'd be amazed if any child could finish even half of the levels in Sunshine... and there is a fairly huge change from Mario 64 as it happens. Possibly just in the way the tasks are structured but it doesn't feel quite like Mario 64... someone please back me up here. ;)
(Well put Reznor007 btw. People seem to be forgetting that a lot.)
Though the more I see the more I'm sure there's a good chunk of modified Sunshine engine gone into Zelda... it sometimes just hits you when you're playing certain sections. The entry area of Pinna Park with the palm trees and sunflowers just looks so much like it could've come from the new Zelda. Heck, if I get my Zelda demo disc in time I'll throw some more on that subject into my eventual review.
Also, Luigi's Mansion is a damn sight more fun than it gets credit for. The NGC's "Pilotwings 64" equivalent perhaps...
 

RatTrap

GODLIKE
yeah.. i agree with you on that kids probably won't be able to finish all the lvls.. i mean them weird parts without the watergizmo get freaken hard!.. i've played alot of Mario games.. and never had so much trouble b4.. but at the same time.. my cousin was able to finish the first 3 "worlds"-lvls with the 2 first sunshines or something like that.. and he is a 8 year old.. so you could say it's playable for the litle kids.. and probably even finishable.. but if you wanna finish the whole game.. it's daaamn hard..

about zelda.. it is cell-shaded.. but you see.. in cell-shading there's like 50 billion diferent combinations.. it would be hard to really explain it all.. even normal rendering is a type of cell-shading.. the diference is just a thing you get to choose from.. like adding thicker outlines.. or no outlines.. or adding rendered outlines.. and maybe having only link 2-bit cell-shaded and the rest of the world 3 or even 5-bit cell shaded.. etc.. the posabilities are endless..

but yeah.. in zelda they have probably used part of or the same engine as in mario sunshine.. i'm not sure yet.. it's kind of hard to tell because in cellshading you lose alot of light&shadow.. and replace it with static colors (well not exactly but i'm simplifying abit).. wich can make even a picture of yourself unrecognisable to yourself.. of course though.. the feel might give it away in the end.. but how ever i or you see it.. cell-da is gonna rock :D..

and yeah.. luigis mansio is really nice.. very limited to the amount of times you'll wanna finish it.. but it's a good game.. the originality is what i like about it.. and learning to use controls that way is kind of tricky in the beginning.. the game itself was hellarious.. luigis shicken-shit-ness was just almost too much fun sometimes..
 

Reznor007

New member
yogaman said:
well, erm as far as I can remember a review on tv, mario has to clean an island and to rescue the princess from a phony. IMO the graphics look really nice but I don't see that big change from Mario64 ....
Also Luigis Manson is more of a ghostbuster sequel....

Just play the mission where you ride the roller coaster while Bullet Bills chase you and you have to shoot a giant Bowser robot. There's a big improvement from Mario64.
 

Josep

eyerun4phun
People that say GCN looks childish just have shitty computers. And if you don't have a shitty computer, then you blew too much money on the x-box that has virtually no original games and most of which were originally origniated from the computer. but the thing is with GCN, what other systems can you find super smash brothers? Super monkey ball 2? Super mario sunshine? Animal crossing? Thats right, there are pleanty more and they call those "exclusive" games, not like bullshit games like Turok evolution, wtf, its even on GBA, come on now, PS2 and Xbox have so many ported, unoriginal, and PC games its very hard to count them all, PS2 having actually waay more original games, its mainly x-box i'm targetting at;)
 
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Stalkid64

Stalkid64

Citizen(sixty)four
Just play the mission where you ride the roller coaster while Bullet Bills chase you and you have to shoot a giant Bowser robot. There's a big improvement from Mario64. [/B]
At this point I'd like to bring up the first of the Sirena Bay (or whatever its called) missions "The Manta Storm". Is it just me or is this a modernised 3D version of classic arcade game "Asteroids"..? ;) (Okay, its a little long but hey, good mission.)
The missions do have a distinctly different structure and feel to those in Mario 64... obviously something people won't get from a TV review, and the biggest part of the game. Mario 64 relied a lot on "get to X point in level to get a star". Mario Sunshine relies a lot more in completing increasingly clever tasks which take a darn sight more skill, and are often a lot more rewarding because of it. Some of the `abstract` platforming levels are *exactly* how one of the original Mario games would've been in 3D... right down to the loving tribute style parts where jumping on an enemy is essential to crossing the bigger gaps. I don't know if this is the right way to put it, but the game world and scenery seem much more part of the game... more interactive..?
 

Doomulation

?????????????????????????
Hmm, let's see...running around with a water gun? Erm, pretty childish imo
And it seems pretty boring to the other mario games. I like the old fashion bowser running off with the princess and the great worlds that you'd have to fight through. And the koopa kids!
Gee, they've destroyed it all--even mario64 was bad enough!


And zelda, the gfx looks damn childish imo. I would never play it.
 

Macca

New member
That has got the be one of the saddest posts i've ever read doom :(

knocking off a game because you are "running around with a water gun?" . there is a thing called gameplay. Who gives a fuck if it looks childish, it happens to be a great idea which works on so many levels.

"And it seems pretty boring to the other mario games" have you even played sms yet? I've heard bad things about sms before but calling it plain boring? i'm guessing you haven't played many of the missions.

"I like the old fashion bowser running off with the princess and the great worlds that you'd have to fight through. And the koopa kids!
Gee, they've destroyed it all--even mario64 was bad enough!" Ahhh, that kind describes the story of sms. after a few missions, bowser does run off with peach and there are great levels to fight through.

"Gee, they've destroyed it all--even mario64 was bad enough!" Yeah, a point to be disagreed by the millions of people who love mario64 and the many of them who even classify it as one of the best games of all time, check a few reviews will you.

"And zelda, the gfx looks damn childish imo. I would never play it." Try before you bitch, and don't ignore a game (especially a zelda one, we all know how amazing they are) becuse it looks childish.

Dang, you have the the little respect i had for you before.
 

DuDe

Emu64 Staff
And yet on the other hand, it`s not sad at all to "lose respect" for someone just because his taste in games is, oh may god forbid, different than yours.
 

Macca

New member
i never said it was his taste of games Dude. I said it was the fact that he can call a game childish and by the context of his post, shithouse, without even having experience in it. And then refusing to play a game becuase it looks childish.

If he doesn't like it good for him, but obliosly he hasn't tried zelda and maybe not even sms and bagging them out without even having a go is wrong.

Sure he can choose not to play a game and dislike one, but at least a vaild reason could be given. Hell, thats all you ever post about, people no liking the box cause its MS which i understand. People's opinons should be based on something vaild not fluff.

I know its his opinion and everyone is entitled to theirs, which is what these forums are about.
 
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blizz

New member
Stalkid64 said:
Some of the `abstract` platforming levels are *exactly* how one of the original Mario games would've been in 3D... right down to the loving tribute style parts where jumping on an enemy is essential to crossing the bigger gaps. I don't know if this is the right way to put it, but the game world and scenery seem much more part of the game... more interactive..?

those are the levels I enjoy the most, some of them are pretty tough, but know where near as annoying as some of the other levels ;)
 

vampireuk

Mr. Super Clever
Everyone is like this when it comes to games, and it pisses me off.

Oh your game sucks mines more fun

Well thats ok then if you like boring games

ffs people its a matter of opinion, dont have a go at someone because they like a different game to you. Your opinions are no more valid than the next persons so dont get all iffy and saying they have crap taste.

Now sit down and shut up cause all your games suck anyway :p:D
 
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