[$threadinfo[title]]

[lightknight]

those who want to than just email..once i get few people to help me to statr working on it...i will be using Dev C+++ 4 to code it in windows!! and am thinking bout doeing it in direct x 8.1 and openglide!! and i want to sart a n64 emulatore with based on 1964 71 source code with Daedalus 0.08 Pre-1 Source code!! :cool: :D :D :D :cool:

[Slougi]

Why don't you do it in opengl? isn't that faster?

[sytaylor]

plus the gamecube uses opengl...plus why devC? it has NO help files and i find its compiler results to be VERY confusing

[lightknight]

i have been learning a lot of C++ there ...
:D :cool:

i am learning alot in there Tutorials! you should check them out...if you to help me out..

[mesman00]

just a few questions....
if you have been learning from tutorials
1. how much do u know?
2. how long have you been programming?
3. do u konw any graphics programming, such as direct x, opengl
4. do u know any sound programming?
5. do u know anything about the gamecubes technical crap (processor and all that junk) there are very little docs released about it, if any

i hope you are pretty good at c++ and have been programming for quite some time, and havent just picked it up through tutorials over the last 6 months or so. otherwise you are in a lot of trouble. maybe you ought to start out with something less complex, like the NES, especially because it has alot of Doc's on it.

I don't mean to discourage you, but just to warn you

[Cyberman]

Yes indeed experience helps with writting software.

Now the manufacturer of the graphics chipset for it is ATI.. you won't find anything on ther WEBSITE other than.. they make it :)

I believe they are using a PowerPC with added instructions.. little red flags should go up with that because.. those added instructions can be anoying problems.

They have 24M of Static ram built in.. I think the processor speed is 200mhz.. a 200mhz PPC = 700mhz Athalon. That doesn't bode well. Especially since we are emulating the hardware for the graphics..


Maybe when we get pentiums going 4ghz?

Cyb

[lightknight]

just start with a few opcodes in the cpu for LUIGIS-MANSION! and heres the what i found out about the system so far

MPU("Microprocessor Unit")* Custom IBM Power PC "Gekko"

Manufacturing Process 0.18 micron IBM Copper Wire Technology

Clock Frequency 485 MHz

CPU Capacity 1125 Dmips (Dhrystone 2.1)

Internal Data Precision 32-bit Integer & 64-bit Floating-point

External Bus 1.3GB/second peak bandwidth (32-bit address space, 64-bit data bus 162 MHz clock)

Internal Cache L1: Instruction 32KB, Data 32KB (8 way) L2: 256KB (2 way)

System LSI Custom ATI/Nintendo "Flipper"

Manufacturing Process 0.18 micron NEC Embedded DRAM Process

Clock Frequency 162 MHz

Embedded Frame Buffer Approx. 2MB Sustainable Latency : 6.2ns (1T-SRAM)

Embedded Texture Cache Approx. 1MB Sustainable Latency : 6.2ns (1T-SRAM)

Texture Read Bandwidth 10.4GB/second (Peak)

Main Memory Bandwidth 2.6GB/second (Peak)

Pixel Depth 24-bit Color, 24-bit Z Buffer

Image Processing Functions Fog, Subpixel Anti-aliasing, 8 Hardware Lights, Alpha Blending, Virtual Texture Design, Multi-texturing, Bump Mapping, Environment Mapping, MIP Mapping, Bilinear Filtering, Trilinear Filtering, Anisotropic Filtering, Real-time Hardware Texture Decompression (S3TC), Real-time Decompression of Display List, HW 3-line Deflickering filter



The following sound related functions are all incorporated into the System LSI

Sound Processor custom Macronix 16-bit DSP

Instruction Memory 8KB RAM + 8KB ROM

Data Memory 8KB RAM + 4KB ROM

Clock Frequency 81 MHz

Performance 64 simultaneous channels, ADPCM encoding

Sampling Frequency 48KHz

System Floating-point Arithmetic Capability 10.5 GFLOPS (Peak) (MPU, Geometry Engine, HW Lighting Total)

Real-world polygon 6 million to 12 million polygons/second (Peak) (Assuming actual game conditions with complex models, fully textured, fully lit, etc.)

System Memory 40MB

Main Memory 24 MB MoSys 1T-SRAM, Approximately 10ns Sustainable Latency

A-Memory 16MB (81MHz DRAM)

Disc Drive CAV (Constant Angular Velocity) System

Average Access Time 128ms

Data Transfer Speed 16Mbps to 25Mbps

Media 3 inch NINTENDO GAMECUBE Disc based on Matsushita's
Optical Disc Technology, Approx. 1.5GB Capacity

Input/Output Controller Port x4
Memory Card Slot x2
Analog AV Output x1
Digital AV Output x1
High-Speed Serial Port x2
High-speed Parallel Port x1

Power Supply AC Adapter DC12V x 3.5A
Main Unit Dimensions 4.3"(H) x 5.9"(W) x 6.3"(D)

:D :D

[Cyberman]

Actually you start out with your basic PPC instruction set and find out what forces an exception when decoded. :)
The PPC might be easier to decode than most CPU's I don't know but IBM probably has the opcode map on the WEB site somewhere. I would start with that. I expect implementing illegal opcode exception handling will find the opcodes that are NEW :)
In all likely hood those are relating to 3d geometry transformations and other useful 3d primitives possibly some audio type things but if there is a DSP I suspect that will handle the bulk of the audio fun. IE MP3 decoding ET AL.

Cyb

[dixon]

not to put you down or anything, lightknight, but i don't think anybody is going to take you seriously. the best thing to do, if you are going to take it seriously, is to get yourself some VERY GOOD programmers (u will need to show them ur work for them to work with you), and stay quiet for about a year. In that time, you should have had enough time to start the very basics of emulating a part of the gamecube.

just a little word of advice ;)

[gokuss4]

well i heard that the gamecube is less complicating than the N64 which i think is a little true.

[CpU MasteR]

Well, I will be able to donate my services... I know Much about Microprosessors... I am learing C++ slowly, I code in Microsoft Visual Basic 6... I think it will be possible mostly because of the hardware... What do you think?

[Azimer]

If you find a NGC devkit, let me know... Then perhaps I might be interested in helping you port.
( I just really want the devkit :) )

[Zero]

Lightknight I don't mean this to discourage you but you should first start with something which isn't as complicated as a N64 or a Gamecube the best thing you can do is to start developing a NES or GB(C) emulator which are fairly easy to develop comparing it to a Gamecube or an N64.I say this because you first got to learn the basics of development/codingthen after you know the basics you could always go even further and take a harder test like a Gamecube or N64 emu but in the mean time work on something smaller like a GB emu (I myself have started learnig C , C++ about a year ago and have been using it since seven months to develop a GB emu which I'm gonna re-release on 01/01/2002
P.S I'm making really great progress so I might throw in some new features (maybe even GBC emulation caus I tried to play Pokemon Silver on the emu and it boots up runs the demo but there are still some GFX bugs I need to get rid of but if lucky you'll see a new GB and GBC emu being released instead of a GB emu).

[Raging Fuel]

Originally posted by Azimer
If you find a NGC devkit, let me know... Then perhaps I might be interested in helping you port.
( I just really want the devkit :) )

Hmmm... some how I can't see that happening soon :)

[Cyberman]

Yeah the NGC Dev kit would make it possible.
It's librarys and header files are the key to emulating it :)

Cyb

[lightknight]

places to start at?:cool: :cool: the key to emulat it is in the power of the software!!!!:D :cool:

[Zero]

It will be hard to make such a thing possible seeing that the GC uses mini-DVD's which are also protected by a little sort of points on the bottom side of the disc.So this will make rom dumping impossible in my opinion.It might be able to make backups of the GC games but this will need mini-DVD's or normal DVD's and a DVD writer which are really quite expensive.

But if you (lightknight) manage to get a NGC devkit (not likely) I will offer my services to help you make a port.

[Raging Fuel]

Originally posted by Zero
It will be hard to make such a thing possible seeing that the GC uses mini-DVD's which are also protected by a little sort of points on the bottom side of the disc.So this will make rom dumping impossible in my opinion.It might be able to make backups of the GC games but this will need mini-DVD's or normal DVD's and a DVD writer which are really quite expensive.

But if you (lightknight) manage to get a NGC devkit (not likely) I will offer my services to help you make a port.

The easiest way to make dumps of GC games would probably be to use the serial port that it has to connect it to a PC. Apparently there is already something which plugs into the port that allows you to play burnt games on it (I assume that the games would be burnt onto a DVD, and that would be the most expensive part.)

[lightknight]

to and from the system.....and than to cd...

[Cyberman]

I hope the serial port on that thing is VERY Fast because you might be taking a LONG nap while it copies the data :)

if it plays Mini DVD's how do you make it the right size? trimmer? :)

Cyb

[Jsr]

Well, I think we have a little bit left to GC emulators, but
somewere do we have to begin :)

[Cyberman]

Well for GC emulation you have a number of things to deal with.
Mini DVD's (Image files will be the only way to do this to begin the process) This requires a DVD-driver
Then you have Sound
Video
Input devices.
CPU - (custom power PC chip)
It might be a bit indeed.

Cyb

[Renegade]

you guys aren't discouraging him, are you?
btw, if you want to develop the GameCube emulator, make sure you have:

- thorough, thorough knowledge of the Gamecube hardware
- thorough, thorough knowledge of the Gamecube software
- read through some guides on how to program emulators
- got all the equipment you need
- got all the Talent you need
- a lot of time, as well as patience

Good luck. I hope you progress ;)

OH YES, AND IF YOU WANT TO MAKE A GC EMULATOR, MAKE IT VERY HUSH HUSH. YOU HERE ME?!!!! HUSH-HUSH!!!!!!

[Azimer]

I just wanna program ON it :(

Someone give me a devkit and directions on how to move my program onto the NGC :)

I swear console makers should allow 3rd party people to noncommerically work on their systems. ???

[speedbutt]

lightknight dont pay attention on those people ,

you want to do a GC emulator go for it :cool:

sure i'll be hard :D

but it's better trying than to listen to those moron and go for an emulator less difficult that you dont care anyway.:hrm:

And BTW good luck u'll need it.

[Renegade]

...well said.

[CpU MasteR]

Yeah, You guys have a good thing going here, You have alot of people wanting to help, I think you guys will emulate soon if you really work hard...

[Teamz]

soon? funny!

[Jsr]

But actually, how much do you know about emulating?

[gokuss4]

well if you make a gc emu make it comaptible with mini-dvd drives and regular dvd drives also kina like bleem, and also make it support gc isos if someone ever makes a gc emu, and oh yeah here is all the video image processing you have to do lol

Fog, Subpixel Anti-aliasing, 8 Hardware Lights, Alpha Blending, Virtual Texture Design, Multi-texturing, Bump Mapping, Environment Mapping, MIP Mapping, Bilinear Filtering, Trilinear Filtering, Anisotropic Filtering, Real-time Hardware Texture Decompression (S3TC), Real-time Decompression of Display List, HW 3-line Deflickering filter

and thats it lol ;)

[adfcy]

Hi I Would like to do some core in asm if interested gimme call
salam
cordial :cool:

[CpU MasteR]

Originally posted by Jsr
But actually, how much do you know about emulating?

Well, About the GameCube, The Prosessor Probably won't be that hard because it sorta an Macintosh Based Prosessor made by IBM... FInding the Opcodes Maybe Hard...

[Cyberman]

CpU MasteR wrote
Well, About the GameCube, The Prosessor Probably won't be that hard because it sorta an Macintosh Based Prosessor made by IBM... FInding the Opcodes Maybe Hard...
It's a power PC processor.. if someone got me the series I could find the opcode map for it. It has some custom instructions as well. That's where things get tricky with emulating the game cube.

To be honest I have even played the game cube yet!

Cyb

[icepir8]

I bet no one can come up with the necessary docs on the rest of the hardware. I would like to see some one prove me wrong, but I don't think its going to happen any time soon.

Cya,


Icepir8

[Reznor007]

The CPU is an IBM PowerPC 750cx (with custom opcodes). Also modified to allow dual 32bit ops instead of a single 64bit op at programmer's discretion.

[CpU MasteR]

Originally posted by Cyberman

It has some custom instructions as well.

I Tried, I couldnt find it... It would have been easier about 1 year ago but know it is going to be tough to find the OpCodes...

Originally posted by Cyberman

It's a power PC processor..

Ya, and Power PC IS a Macintosh based CPU, Where do you think Apple Buys it CPUs from?

[Reznor007]

Little difference though:

Apple uses Motorolla PowerPC chips(G3, G4)
Nintendo uses IBM PowerPC chips(750cx)

[CpU MasteR]

Originally posted by icepir8
I bet no one can come up with the necessary docs on the rest of the hardware. I would like to see some one prove me wrong, but I don't think its going to happen any time soon.

Cya,


Icepir8

How Would you like this? Fast or SLOW?? :devil: ;) THese are the Command Registers...

[Harteex]

I know this is a custom chip, but I don't know if there are many differences.
Alot of information about the IBM PowerPC 750 cx chips is available here: http://www-3.ibm.com/chips/techlib/techlib.nsf/products/PowerPC_750CX_and_750CXe_Microprocessor

In case you didn't know, The gamecube OS is made by CodeWarrior.

[CpU MasteR]

Originally posted by Harteex
I know this is a custom chip, but I don't know if there are many differences.
Alot of information about the IBM PowerPC 750 cx chips is available here: http://www-3.ibm.com/chips/techlib/techlib.nsf/products/PowerPC_750CX_and_750CXe_Microprocessor

Yeah, Thats Where I got it from...

Originally posted by Harteex
In case you didn't know, The gamecube OS is made by CodeWarrior

Hmmm, No I didn't, Me and You Should talk.... :cool:

[Azimer]

CodeWarrior made the development environment... You still need the SDK and the Hardware.

That CPU information is not GC information. You need more info then a CPU... otherwise you are left with a CPU emulator and nothing to run on it ;)

[icepir8]

Originally posted by Azimer
CodeWarrior made the development environment... You still need the SDK and the Hardware.

That CPU information is not GC information. You need more info then a CPU... otherwise you are left with a CPU emulator and nothing to run on it ;)

Well said Azimer! I already have the CPU info.

:tr64:

[CpU MasteR]

Originally posted by Azimer
CodeWarrior made the development environment... You still need the SDK and the Hardware.

That CPU information is not GC information. You need more info then a CPU... otherwise you are left with a CPU emulator and nothing to run on it ;)

Yes, I just dont need to CPU Commands, I need the other hardware specs as well as the software specs, I need to examine more into this... I am Learing how to code, So If I start now, I may have it by 2005... ???

[Harteex]

Originally posted by Azimer
That CPU information is not GC information. You need more info then a CPU... otherwise you are left with a CPU emulator and nothing to run on it ;)

Well, at least it's a good start, don't you think? :D ;)

[Renegade]

allllll right, for whoever wants to do GC programming, should have the following credentials:
5+ years of C/C++ programming
and best would have to have 1 year at least of GC programming.

how do I know? because that's the minimum requirements to be a Senior Programmer for Retro studios, who is looknig for a replacement for a programmer for making METROID PRIME. :plain:

[Teamz]

I agree with Harteex, even if we only have the CPU emulated, there's a beginning to everything :)

[Cyberman]

I suppose you can work on it, however don't put yourself into Nintendo's target hairs. Meaning? Don't do anything that can be publicized give you credit for making an emulator for the Nintendo Game Cube etc. Remember these people has spent millions of dollars making this system and expect to make money off selling software and hardware for the system in many years to come.

VGS and Bleam both comercial products got into controversy, do not think you are immune to legal and highly punitive actions by these companys.

[CpU MasteR]

Originally posted by Teamz
I agree with Harteex, even if we only have the CPU emulated, there's a beginning to everything :)

Yeah, I am Going to get the SDK, This will take a while.... But As Soon as I get the SDK... We Can Pretty much get this thing under way...

[Reznor007]

Originally posted by Cyberman
I suppose you can work on it, however don't put yourself into Nintendo's target hairs. Meaning? Don't do anything that can be publicized give you credit for making an emulator for the Nintendo Game Cube etc. Remember these people has spent millions of dollars making this system and expect to make money off selling software and hardware for the system in many years to come.

VGS and Bleam both comercial products got into controversy, do not think you are immune to legal and highly punitive actions by these companys.

Million? Heh, they have a $1 Billion contract with IBM alone.

[lightknight]

and i want it to be fast!! we can start it out like ultrahle and than make changes and than make it like pj641.4!! but with more gfx options and with plugins for the controler and sound!! and gfx maybe at first..

[Renegade]

big ambitions from someone who hasn't got 5 years experience of C++ and 1 year of GC programming.

[Epic64]

Sorry Guys but it ain't gonna happen! Much more chance of someone making an N64 emu for the GC. Sounds like Azi is up for it ;) Does anyone know if it's possible for the GC to read normal CD-roms? If not then even that isn't gonna happen.

[Reznor007]

Gamecube will not read a normal compact disc mini-single.

[lightknight]

the main emulatore program!!


Applied's emulation technology delivers the critical visibility and communications channel into both the host and target environment so that game developers can control the quality of their code and data through emulation of their optical disk environment. Using this optical disk emulation technology, developers can compile code while they emulate -- thereby significantly shortening the time game title development typically takes today.

This next generation optical disc emulation technology emulates the physical characteristics of the optical disk drive by adjusting the transfer rate of data coming from the hard drive. Armed with this tool, developers can observe spin up/down, head seek and rotational time, disc cache operation, and the data transfer rate based on the physical location of data on the drive. Applied's optical disk emulation technology allows the developer to inject errors to simulate scratches or bad discs so typical variations caused by these real-life factors can be accurately managed at the development stage.

this should work!!! if u know what i mean.:) :) :) :) :cool: :cool: :cool: :cool: :cool: :cool:

[Renegade]

I'm sceptical...???

[Cyberman]

LK

I Read that article a while back it's for developers I know you are excited etc. However start working toward your goal instead of hyping it up. Excitement is cool but doing something is better.

Cyb

[little_dogus1]

Texture Read Bandwidth 10.4GB/second (Peak)

correct me if im wrong(i would love to be wrong on this one lol) but isnt the pc texture read bandwidth up to 5 gb/second (peak)
can you really emulate more???
but then agoin i suppose that by the time someone makes a gamecube emulator the pc will have matching bandwidth.


btw. good luck( if i ever get the required crudentials ill contact you)
allllll right, for whoever wants to do GC programming, should have the following credentials:
5 years noooooooo ive still got 2 to go

[Mr. Frisbee III]

About the GC discs...are they the same size as those little mini-cd things? You can get them in mini-CD-R format...If they are the same size, then they should fit into any DVD-ROM drive. Can a standard PC DVD-ROM drive actually READ GC discs? Like with the old Sega Saturn, you could see all the files on a disc. Or are they similar to Dreamcast discs: the actual game data on a GD-ROM was unreadable at all by a PC. This is assuming the GC uses the DVD-ROM format for games, and not some strange custom format like the DC...

[Crazed376]

The GC discs are a proprietary format.

[pj64er]

Originally posted by Crazed376
The GC discs are a proprietary format.

right on.

without something to read this format(dont even think CDR, DVD should be similar), lightknight and his "emulatore" is going nowhere.

[Remote]

A gamecube emulator will be made, perhaps not by lightknight... but someone will crack the encryption... And the properairy discs are the smallest problem, there is always a way to transfer data... And why would he need atleast five years of experince... I bet you could find hundreds of people who have only started coding who are lightyears closer to making a Gamecube emulator compared to more experienced people...

[Mr. Frisbee III]

little_dogus1: Texture Read Bandwidth 10.4GB/second (Peak)

Isn't the Texture Read Bandwidth dependent on the graphics card? Or am I thinking of VRAM bandwidth?

[pj64er]

Originally posted by Remote
A gamecube emulator will be made, perhaps not by lightknight... but someone will crack the encryption... And the properairy discs are the smallest problem, there is always a way to transfer data... And why would he need atleast five years of experince... I bet you could find hundreds of people who have only started coding who are lightyears closer to making a Gamecube emulator compared to more experienced people...

the encrytion (it shouldnt be called this, i dont know a better word) of the discs are a small problem. but it is one of the first problems. if lightknight has no idea how to do this, the core and gfx are way out of his reach.

btw, the way how lightknight saids he wants to make a emu like UHLE and then turn it into pj64 just took the crediblity right out of him. lightknight has no idea what he is talking about. he prolly wants ppl to make an emu and freeload off of it.

[Renegade]

that I prefer only pple like Jabo and zilmar or rice and schibo to get somewhere in an emulator.

from lightknight's way of talking about the emu, i doubt he understands the NES.

[linker]

Originally posted by pj64er

without something to read this format(dont even think CDR, DVD should be similar), lightknight and his "emulatore" is going nowhere.

#include "emulatore.h"
#include "miniopticalcd.h"


int main()
{
printf("\nAmmm... LOL.\n");
printf("Give that emulatore here, lightknight\n");

return (-1); //Unknown error
}

[aprentice]

ROTF this thread is hilarious. Guys, from post #1 your suppose to know hes full of shit.

[CpU MasteR]

Originally posted by aprentice
ROTF this thread is hilarious. Guys, from post #1 your suppose to know hes full of shit.

We Know, We are Just Humoring him :satisfied

[CpU MasteR]

Well, While We are at it...
:bs:
kthx