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Another one bites the dust.

T

TigerTron

New member
I was writing to this thread:
http://www.emutalk.net/showthread.php?s=&threadid=9308

It was not closed when i clicked on "Reply". I finished my nagging and clickd on "Submit Post". But, the thread was closed (thank god for the back-button).
So i am writing this in a new thread, i do not care if you close or if you do not close. But maybe i will get more users saying what they think in this one too.





**************************

Is it because now the staff is scared of closing threads?.

I do not think anyone "whines" because the threads are closed. It is very simple. No threads means no discussions. I do not take anything in here personally, and i hope for you that you do not take things personally too.

The thread that Stalkid keeps speaking of; i am not sure. I am not part of the leading staff of this website. So i can not say if it is or if it is not "ok". But saying that only staff and Martin are aloud to argue, is almost like telling the people who buy your bread. That they have to buy the same bread for the same price tomorrow, but they can not eat all of it. It is supposed to be the other way around, the buyer is allways right (within limited parameters = "common sence").

This does not mean that the users need to be leading EmuTalk, it means that they need to lead the discussions, and be left free to do so. As long as they follow the rules. The rules need to be much clearer and they need to be fair for everyone. Also i saw the warning system, it is a good idea. I have not seen it being used yet. I hope i do not get to see it working at all (on me, i mean :D ). I believe the moderators should do more fixing then deleting and closing.

I am unsertain, but i do not think anyone gets paid or pays to visit this websajt. But it is still the same. You have to think comercially, what is good for a website and what is bad. Even if you do not get just one dollar from it. Because EmuTalk is to big, to think in more personal ways.

I have had a discussion with Martin on another thread, and i am starting to believe his promise (but i still believe he is mean :innocent: ). And i hope very much that this board gets alot better in the future.

Edited:
I noticed the other smilies, and i found very few good ones. I still believe you need alot more smilies. Bunnies, alot more bunnies :bunny: :inlove: .
 
Last edited:
Martin

Martin

Active member
Administrator
Scared of closing threads? It's been the other way around lately, but that's a trend we'll try to change, especially with the help of the new warnings system. I do think that the staff don't intend to lock threads for the pure fun of it, but because they believe the thread has gone too off-topic or are discussing things not meant to be discussed. But I do think that some threads should not have been closed as early as they've been. On the other hands, some should.

Moderating is all about drawing a line and preventing the members from crossing it. If they cross it, though, we must take action.

More smilies? Hook me up. :D
 
Eagle

Eagle

aka Alshain
Moderator
Well, we are desperately trying to cut down the spam, some of the mods are going a little overboard. However I do believe that thread you linked to was nothing but whining and I consider that spam, thats why I suggested it be locked.
 
bodie

bodie

Member
i agree with stalkid to a point .. i don't want to close any thread ..i also believe a forum is for discussion but if i feel that discussion has been answered and run it's natural course then i will close a thread..A good forum is never going to happen if you keep the same topics alive for fear of closing ..the point of 'said' topic has registered with the appropriate people to add to that is counter productive to what we are trying to do
 
OP
T

TigerTron

New member
I do not believe that is the correct way. That is called controll, not freedom.

I am not sure how many of you have long discussions with anyone. But when you talk to someone, about a topic. It allways changes abit. If your in the kitchen discussing something with a friend, something that keeps changing all the time. Just because of that you don't officially stop talking and move over to the livingroom to change the topic.

Maybe you will go back to the topic by saying "but let's stay on topic" or something as that.

I find myself very limited when i start a thread and come back later that same evening to read what people have said and try to post and find that i can not reply. Because someone steped in and said: "The discussion is over!". And then everyone has to talk about something else.

Edited:
Cute smilies eagle! can't you find more bunnies?
 
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Eagle

Eagle

aka Alshain
Moderator
Well, I think he meant off topic as in not appying to the specific forum that its in. Talk of the Town is just about anything, but If I close a post in Tech Talk becasue its going off topic, it usually means that its becoming so that it has no relation to PC troubleshooting or anything similar.

EDIT: No I dont have any bunnies :bunny: :bunny: :bunny:
 
OP
T

TigerTron

New member
You are of course right, but i have noticed also a big diference.

If a few new users or other normal users do that, the thread will be closed. But you can see discussions with moderators doing the same thing, and those won't be closed. I also have seen the more priviliged users like authors do the same thing. They get away with it and nobody says anything.

I think a thread that has gonne wrong for any reason, should have many more diferent options. Before it is officially closed. Closing a thread is the easy way out. It's almost as good as baning someone, they will come back. All you do is delay the matter at hand instead of taking care of it at the time it should be taken care of.

Edited:
I have seen alot of small animations before. But these bunnies are really cute :bunny: :inlove: .
 
vampireuk

vampireuk

Mr. Super Clever
What your saying is right and it will start to happen but perhaps we should also be given a little breathing space for mistakes since we are trying to get back to normal. Some of the mods(including me) have been a bit heavy handed and I admiited that in another thread. No offence intended at all but give us a teeeeny bit of time to get back in swing:)
 
Eagle

Eagle

aka Alshain
Moderator
Yes, In addition we have several new mods who are still learning the ropes. It will slowly move back to normal, but we are making an effort to make things better. 3 weeks ago EmuTalk was a spamfest and now in an effort to compensate, a lot of us (including myself at times) have gone a bit too far and overcompensated. But like Vamp said, we are only human and we are doing out best.
 
OP
T

TigerTron

New member
I am sorry if i have been abit hard in my words. I will forgive you all, be nicer and stop complaining on one condition. You get some new bunnies :D .

:bunny: :inlove:
 
Harteex

Harteex

Harteex das Brot
smilies.nl have a lot of smilies...

not bunny but cute:
ylflower.gif
;)
Music:
music049.gif
music487.gif
:)
Happy, bouncing!
huepfenicon111.gif
:D
 
EmuNut

EmuNut

Public Enemy No. 1
TigerTron said:
I was writing to this thread:
http://www.emutalk.net/showthread.php?s=&threadid=9308

It was not closed when i clicked on "Reply". I finished my nagging and clickd on "Submit Post". But, the thread was closed (thank god for the back-button).
So i am writing this in a new thread, i do not care if you close or if you do not close. But maybe i will get more users saying what they think in this one too.





**************************

Is it because now the staff is scared of closing threads?.

I do not think anyone "whines" because the threads are closed. It is very simple. No threads means no discussions. I do not take anything in here personally, and i hope for you that you do not take things personally too.

The thread that Stalkid keeps speaking of; i am not sure. I am not part of the leading staff of this website. So i can not say if it is or if it is not "ok". But saying that only staff and Martin are aloud to argue, is almost like telling the people who buy your bread. That they have to buy the same bread for the same price tomorrow, but they can not eat all of it. It is supposed to be the other way around, the buyer is allways right (within limited parameters = "common sence").

This does not mean that the users need to be leading EmuTalk, it means that they need to lead the discussions, and be left free to do so. As long as they follow the rules. The rules need to be much clearer and they need to be fair for everyone. Also i saw the warning system, it is a good idea. I have not seen it being used yet. I hope i do not get to see it working at all (on me, i mean :D ). I believe the moderators should do more fixing then deleting and closing.

I am unsertain, but i do not think anyone gets paid or pays to visit this websajt. But it is still the same. You have to think comercially, what is good for a website and what is bad. Even if you do not get just one dollar from it. Because EmuTalk is to big, to think in more personal ways.

I have had a discussion with Martin on another thread, and i am starting to believe his promise (but i still believe he is mean :innocent: ). And i hope very much that this board gets alot better in the future.

Edited:
I noticed the other smilies, and i found very few good ones. I still believe you need alot more smilies. Bunnies, alot more bunnies :bunny: :inlove: .
Click to expand...

You have a very good point, but to summarize all the replies to this thread leave room for human error and training for the new mods.
 
Last edited:
Keith

Keith

The Show Must Go On!
Administrator
TigerTron said:
I do not believe that is the correct way. That is called controll, not freedom.

I am not sure how many of you have long discussions with anyone. But when you talk to someone, about a topic. It allways changes abit. If your in the kitchen discussing something with a friend, something that keeps changing all the time. Just because of that you don't officially stop talking and move over to the livingroom to change the topic.

Maybe you will go back to the topic by saying "but let's stay on topic" or something as that.

I find myself very limited when i start a thread and come back later that same evening to read what people have said and try to post and find that i can not reply. Because someone steped in and said: "The discussion is over!". And then everyone has to talk about something else.

Edited:
Cute smilies eagle! can't you find more bunnies?
Click to expand...
Ahh but you have to remember that a Discussion Forum is a different Platform for discussion then lets say something more live action like IRC, the phone, or even in person. There is a reason that threads have a "Topic". The topic is what the thread is all about, going off topic can be frustrating for some, especially if they are trying to find info on the actual topic the thread was about. There is a simple rule when it comes to Forums. Stay on topic and if you need to go off topic with someone then use the PM feature or start a new thread in a forum more suited for it. Feel free to link back to the other discussion if it applies to the discussion like you did with this thread.

Just remember a forum is not so interactive where it would be easy to jump from one conversation to the next. There needs to be order (not control) on a forum in order to stop threads from getting chaotic. This doesn't mean your freedom to post was being taken away, just means there needed to be some action taken to the thread because it was getting out of control. In order to prevent these types of situations, do like I suggested and send a PM or start a new thread in the forum it belongs. Pretty simple if you ask me, doesn't have to be made into a big deal or made into a contraversy. The mods are here to help and in order to do that they have to take certain steps, and at times you might not agree with them, but you should atleast except them and respect them. Be opened minded, and try to think why it was done, I don't think any of the mods are out on a power trip closing threads without a reason.

And if you do have a legit reason to be concerned then feel free to msg me and I will bring up the matter and help get it resolved.

Just some food for thought :D
 
OP
T

TigerTron

New member
I know i said i was going to be nice. But you asked for this one :devil: .

If a topic goes off topic, it should not be closed. That is what i am saying. It should be the last thing to be donne. Martin has told me this too. And that he agrees with me.

I do not feel like messaging a stranger as much as i feel like arguing with him in an open forum. It becomes alot more personal when you PM that user, and this is not supposed to be that way. Not for me, at least. It's an open discussion where anyone can participate. I agree on the "stay on topic" part. But you have to agree, that moving a litle bit "off topic" does not hurt anyone. If anything should be donne, is maybe asking the users to please stay on topic, not close.

The new moderators you have chosen have been chosen because they have been here for a while. Because they behave, feel they can help and also because you need them. If these new "mods" have been here for a while, then they know the "deal" or "ropes", more or less. They know that threads can't be closed all over the place because of spam or this or the other simple reason.

I have also noticed that the moderators closing the threads are not normally TrotterWatch, VampireUK and AllNatural. I believe these are the new ones, no? Some of the closed threads have been closed by the older moderators. I feel that these 3 new moderators are of course still learning. But then why does the old moderators act worse then the new ones?

I have noticed also that moderators are good with going off the topic. So what example does that represent? The rules are also not making it easy for some. I refer to Stalkids thread in "Talk Of The Town". The things that he has had a discussion about are being put in a "grey" area by the moderators of a forum that is allready inside the same "grey" area. You can argue how much you want, but right is right and wrong is wrong. If you are going to allow one, you have to allow the other. Unless you just simply do not want to allow the other. But then, in the rules it should be stated very clearly. Like Smiffs post has sudgested in that same thread.

There are many things that you can say are wrong with EmuTalk. But i believe it is not just the users. The users learn from seeing, and i have noticed that some users can be very helpfull and then very anoying in other parts. It is generally for the mods themselfs to act in a way that will show respect and manners. Especially if the users are young adults or children. The language plays a vital role (i am sorry, i try to spell the best i can), so does the attitude. And the open mindness.
 
Cyberman

Cyberman

Moderator
Moderator
You mean the moderators need to set a proper example themselves or something akin to that?

The place is only as good as it's leaders? Hmmmm maybe.. I don't think the forums are a good place for argueing though. Just cool headed discusion. I've seen a lot of people go and say a bunch of things that well simply aren't true like it's a religious thing for them. That's just kind of other than boring misleading, or the blind leading the blind.

What does help though is say "umm kind of off topic here.. no roasting each other in public unless you bring the marsh mellows." :)

Arguing for the sake of arguement is fruitless waste of air and time. However if it's like something that needs to be thought through carefully it's worth it. What I've seen here, arguing which plugin works best or if MS stole Unix or not.. is subjective and also kind of moot it doesn't produce anything.

It's best to inform not give opinions, they aren't based on fact, they are ussually based on feelings. :p Everyone has opinions, I just don't think one needs to voice them without going through the facts first.

Cyb
 
Keith

Keith

The Show Must Go On!
Administrator
Whoa you either didn't read what I posted correctly or you didn't understand.

1.) If the thread starts to go off topic, then stop it and take it somewhere, where it is more appropriate. For example if it is just a conversation with two people, going back and forth in a topic about something unrelated to that topic then use the PM. I see this a lot on many forums. I never said you had to go and PM a stranger. Where you got that idea I don't know.

2.) If the thread goes off topic stop it by opening a topic that does deal with the new topic that is being established in the current topic. Pretty simple if you ask me.

3.) As for closing threads, I never mentioned it once. I am trying to explain to you on how you can prevent that by taking steps to not go off topic. Also going a little offtopic is not that big of a deal, but when it goes way off topic or turns into spam. Then yes something needs to be done.

I see this kind of stuff on many forums, and it really shouldn't be made into a big deal. The board is setup this way, why can't you except that and go along with what is being established. The moderators have one major job and that is to keep order, and to keep the forums a friendly, and useful place to visit. Having topics that are all over the place is not what EmuTalk needs or wants. So the best you can do is to follow the direction the Forums are going in and respect the wishes of the moderators and just have a good time.

In all honesty it is not that big of a deal and is not that hard to follow. The moderators have a hard job, and have to make decissions that not everyone is going to agree with. That is life, but you have to atleast trust the mods choices and like I said if you feel they are doing something wrong then bring it up to an admin and we will look into it. I personally feel as though they are doing a great job and EmuTalk is getting better all the time, and I see no reason for changes at the moment. This shouldn't be difficult .. it's rather simple really.
 
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